Keefer's 450 shootout next week should be interesting

Myke
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9/12/2017 10:09pm Edited Date/Time 9/14/2017 4:46pm
He talks about it in this podcast. https://www.stitcher.com/podcast/keefer-tested/e/51456362?autoplay=true

He is going to have a round table podcast at the end of each day of testing with a few guys that are doing the testing.

Looking forward to it.
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sgrimmxdad
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9/13/2017 3:40am
I expect it to be very honest and informative!
Johnny Depp
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9/13/2017 6:38am
Until testing starts to include lap times I will take it with a grain of salt.

Just like many US series riders, tester's frequently favor an engine with a hit, and stiff suspension. I need to be convinced that is the fastest way around a moto.

Otherwise,


gsxr6
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9/13/2017 3:18pm
Yamaha wins lol
IceMan446
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9/13/2017 3:41pm
Until testing starts to include lap times I will take it with a grain of salt. Just like many US series riders, tester's frequently favor an...
Until testing starts to include lap times I will take it with a grain of salt.

Just like many US series riders, tester's frequently favor an engine with a hit, and stiff suspension. I need to be convinced that is the fastest way around a moto.

Otherwise,


Have you listened to any of his previous bike review podcasts???

The Shop

TeamGreen
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9/13/2017 3:45pm
Until testing starts to include lap times I will take it with a grain of salt. Just like many US series riders, tester's frequently favor an...
Until testing starts to include lap times I will take it with a grain of salt.

Just like many US series riders, tester's frequently favor an engine with a hit, and stiff suspension. I need to be convinced that is the fastest way around a moto.

Otherwise,


Our testing/shootout, here, included lap and segment times. LitPro works.
tobz
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9/13/2017 4:03pm
I like the sound of this format. Regular updates as the shoot-out progresses.

Sounds like a good way to slightly vary yourself from the other run of the mill shootouts.
tempura
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9/13/2017 4:50pm
Are you saying he will be biased to one particular brand??
kkawboy14
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9/13/2017 4:53pm
Until testing starts to include lap times I will take it with a grain of salt. Just like many US series riders, tester's frequently favor an...
Until testing starts to include lap times I will take it with a grain of salt.

Just like many US series riders, tester's frequently favor an engine with a hit, and stiff suspension. I need to be convinced that is the fastest way around a moto.

Otherwise,


TeamGreen wrote:
Our testing/shootout, here, included lap and segment times. LitPro works.
Kawasaki won....right?
9/13/2017 4:55pm Edited Date/Time 9/13/2017 4:56pm
who thinks Keefer WONT pick the Yamaha? He was the only guy who liked the 17. He worked for Yam and KTM. and guess what? those are his favorite bikes.
Myke
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9/13/2017 5:53pm
who thinks Keefer WONT pick the Yamaha? He was the only guy who liked the 17. He worked for Yam and KTM. and guess what? those...
who thinks Keefer WONT pick the Yamaha? He was the only guy who liked the 17. He worked for Yam and KTM. and guess what? those are his favorite bikes.
I think he will pick it if he truly thinks its the best bike in his opinion.
JMR1976
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9/13/2017 6:15pm
who thinks Keefer WONT pick the Yamaha? He was the only guy who liked the 17. He worked for Yam and KTM. and guess what? those...
who thinks Keefer WONT pick the Yamaha? He was the only guy who liked the 17. He worked for Yam and KTM. and guess what? those are his favorite bikes.
Then don't listen. Am personally looking forward to it.
Johnny Depp
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9/13/2017 6:15pm
Until testing starts to include lap times I will take it with a grain of salt. Just like many US series riders, tester's frequently favor an...
Until testing starts to include lap times I will take it with a grain of salt.

Just like many US series riders, tester's frequently favor an engine with a hit, and stiff suspension. I need to be convinced that is the fastest way around a moto.

Otherwise,


IceMan446 wrote:
Have you listened to any of his previous bike review podcasts???

No, I just read his 450 Offroad GP test at Dirt Rider and there was no timing. Lots of opinions and virtually no setup.
Johnny Depp
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9/13/2017 6:18pm
Until testing starts to include lap times I will take it with a grain of salt. Just like many US series riders, tester's frequently favor an...
Until testing starts to include lap times I will take it with a grain of salt.

Just like many US series riders, tester's frequently favor an engine with a hit, and stiff suspension. I need to be convinced that is the fastest way around a moto.

Otherwise,


TeamGreen wrote:
Our testing/shootout, here, included lap and segment times. LitPro works.
Great news. Exactly.
kkawboy14
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9/14/2017 12:23pm
These guys should do some gag shoot outs where everyone's favorite blows everyone away and then post the real one!
IceMan446
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9/14/2017 12:39pm
No, I just read his 450 Offroad GP test at Dirt Rider and there was no timing. Lots of opinions and virtually no setup.
That was for dirt rider.

I'd suggest to go listen to his podcasts on the bikes he has ridden lately. Very very informative.

Different tracks different days and multiple guys with reviews each day from track they just rode.

better than the rest IMO
kiwifan
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9/14/2017 12:56pm
If Keefer can give an informative and honest comparison then great, the only shootout I put value on these days is Vital's one, even if it doesn't go the brands way that I am currently riding.

The great thing about Vital is that they recognize not every bike suits every person, what might be an amazing bike to one person doesn't mean its amazing for someone else.

9/14/2017 1:03pm
kkawboy14 wrote:
These guys should do some gag shoot outs where everyone's favorite blows everyone away and then post the real one!
They have been doing that for years, they just forget to post the real shootout
Johnny Depp
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9/14/2017 3:19pm
No, I just read his 450 Offroad GP test at Dirt Rider and there was no timing. Lots of opinions and virtually no setup.
IceMan446 wrote:
That was for dirt rider. I'd suggest to go listen to his podcasts on the bikes he has ridden lately. Very very informative. Different tracks different...
That was for dirt rider.

I'd suggest to go listen to his podcasts on the bikes he has ridden lately. Very very informative.

Different tracks different days and multiple guys with reviews each day from track they just rode.

better than the rest IMO
For those that are interested, here's the off road comparison. Seeing how these outsell MX'ers and all come with E-start it's some tasty iron for sure. No green or yellow, but 2 red.

http://www.dirtrider.com/2017-450cc-off-road-gp-bike-comparison



Motofinne
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9/14/2017 3:24pm Edited Date/Time 9/14/2017 3:28pm
I'll look forward to it. I like Keefer and his podcasts.

But Vital is still the number 1 place for shootouts. I have a massive problem with trusting Keefer when he rated the Yamaha number 1 in 2017, i rode the bike and i can't see how anyone that isn't 185cm+ would feel comfy on that bike. I'm not sure if his opinions on bikes relates to my thoughts and experiences of bikes after that. I can understand that he likes that platform but the fact is that the YZ is not the best bike for the average guy(yes i know, we can find exceptions) . Taller people tend to do better on it. The YZ won the Dirt rider shootout in 2017, the only mag that put the YZ as number 1.
Kris Keefer
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9/14/2017 3:41pm Edited Date/Time 9/14/2017 3:49pm
Motofinne wrote:
I'll look forward to it. I like Keefer and his podcasts. But Vital is still the number 1 place for shootouts. I have a massive problem...
I'll look forward to it. I like Keefer and his podcasts.

But Vital is still the number 1 place for shootouts. I have a massive problem with trusting Keefer when he rated the Yamaha number 1 in 2017, i rode the bike and i can't see how anyone that isn't 185cm+ would feel comfy on that bike. I'm not sure if his opinions on bikes relates to my thoughts and experiences of bikes after that. I can understand that he likes that platform but the fact is that the YZ is not the best bike for the average guy(yes i know, we can find exceptions) . Taller people tend to do better on it. The YZ won the Dirt rider shootout in 2017, the only mag that put the YZ as number 1.
Weird thing is that I didn't even ride the 450 Shootout in 2017 because I had a concussion at that time. Dirt Rider tallied up scores (from several testers) and the Yamaha won without me even riding in it. Imagine that! I did write the Shootout with all the notes I had to go off of from all the testers. If you like and trust Vital's Shootout, stick with them. If you like MXA, stick with them. Or read them all. It's America, you're free to back who you choose. I mentioned in my pod to stick with the people you trust (just like in life). I think Vital does do a good job. I will rank the Yamaha first if I think it's the best in 2018, but if it's a piece of shit I'm not scared to say that as well. I don't take manufacturer advertising dollars for that reason. Cheers!
IceMan446
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9/14/2017 3:56pm
Motofinne wrote:
I'll look forward to it. I like Keefer and his podcasts. But Vital is still the number 1 place for shootouts. I have a massive problem...
I'll look forward to it. I like Keefer and his podcasts.

But Vital is still the number 1 place for shootouts. I have a massive problem with trusting Keefer when he rated the Yamaha number 1 in 2017, i rode the bike and i can't see how anyone that isn't 185cm+ would feel comfy on that bike. I'm not sure if his opinions on bikes relates to my thoughts and experiences of bikes after that. I can understand that he likes that platform but the fact is that the YZ is not the best bike for the average guy(yes i know, we can find exceptions) . Taller people tend to do better on it. The YZ won the Dirt rider shootout in 2017, the only mag that put the YZ as number 1.
Same website you are on said the Yamaha 250 sucked.

But every other mag said it was top 3.

Weird.
IceMan446
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9/14/2017 3:59pm
Weird thing is that I didn't even ride the 450 Shootout in 2017 because I had a concussion at that time. Dirt Rider tallied up scores...
Weird thing is that I didn't even ride the 450 Shootout in 2017 because I had a concussion at that time. Dirt Rider tallied up scores (from several testers) and the Yamaha won without me even riding in it. Imagine that! I did write the Shootout with all the notes I had to go off of from all the testers. If you like and trust Vital's Shootout, stick with them. If you like MXA, stick with them. Or read them all. It's America, you're free to back who you choose. I mentioned in my pod to stick with the people you trust (just like in life). I think Vital does do a good job. I will rank the Yamaha first if I think it's the best in 2018, but if it's a piece of shit I'm not scared to say that as well. I don't take manufacturer advertising dollars for that reason. Cheers!
I subscribed to your pods so thank you for the work you put in.

The podcasts are excellent and you are very detailed in set up and what the bike does and doesn't do well.

I have played that damn suspension podcast about 20 times on my way to the track just to make sure I'm adjusting everything right lol

Cant wait for your test and keep up the good work!
Motofinne
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9/14/2017 4:04pm Edited Date/Time 9/14/2017 4:14pm
Motofinne wrote:
I'll look forward to it. I like Keefer and his podcasts. But Vital is still the number 1 place for shootouts. I have a massive problem...
I'll look forward to it. I like Keefer and his podcasts.

But Vital is still the number 1 place for shootouts. I have a massive problem with trusting Keefer when he rated the Yamaha number 1 in 2017, i rode the bike and i can't see how anyone that isn't 185cm+ would feel comfy on that bike. I'm not sure if his opinions on bikes relates to my thoughts and experiences of bikes after that. I can understand that he likes that platform but the fact is that the YZ is not the best bike for the average guy(yes i know, we can find exceptions) . Taller people tend to do better on it. The YZ won the Dirt rider shootout in 2017, the only mag that put the YZ as number 1.
IceMan446 wrote:
Same website you are on said the Yamaha 250 sucked.

But every other mag said it was top 3.

Weird.
Nope. The YZF250 got 4th or 3rd in the Vital shootout depending on how you look at the KTM and Husqvarna(if you rank them as the same bike). I wouldn't call that as a bike that sucks.
Motofinne
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9/14/2017 4:09pm Edited Date/Time 9/14/2017 4:16pm
Motofinne wrote:
I'll look forward to it. I like Keefer and his podcasts. But Vital is still the number 1 place for shootouts. I have a massive problem...
I'll look forward to it. I like Keefer and his podcasts.

But Vital is still the number 1 place for shootouts. I have a massive problem with trusting Keefer when he rated the Yamaha number 1 in 2017, i rode the bike and i can't see how anyone that isn't 185cm+ would feel comfy on that bike. I'm not sure if his opinions on bikes relates to my thoughts and experiences of bikes after that. I can understand that he likes that platform but the fact is that the YZ is not the best bike for the average guy(yes i know, we can find exceptions) . Taller people tend to do better on it. The YZ won the Dirt rider shootout in 2017, the only mag that put the YZ as number 1.
Weird thing is that I didn't even ride the 450 Shootout in 2017 because I had a concussion at that time. Dirt Rider tallied up scores...
Weird thing is that I didn't even ride the 450 Shootout in 2017 because I had a concussion at that time. Dirt Rider tallied up scores (from several testers) and the Yamaha won without me even riding in it. Imagine that! I did write the Shootout with all the notes I had to go off of from all the testers. If you like and trust Vital's Shootout, stick with them. If you like MXA, stick with them. Or read them all. It's America, you're free to back who you choose. I mentioned in my pod to stick with the people you trust (just like in life). I think Vital does do a good job. I will rank the Yamaha first if I think it's the best in 2018, but if it's a piece of shit I'm not scared to say that as well. I don't take manufacturer advertising dollars for that reason. Cheers!
Well that is something i didn't know, i assumed(assuming things is stupid, sorry) the you had the YZF 450 as number 1 in 2017 which is seemed crazy to me after i rode that bike! But i guess that only displays how different we all feel about the bikes?

Keep it going Kris, you're a good dude! I will still say that the YZF 450 2014-2017 sucks for me haha Wink I just don't understand how it would be one of the better bikes for the average guy. I'm only 175cm tall so i'm on the shorter side but it really felt like a tank. Great suspension and strong motor but it had bad brakes and turned below average.

Johnny Depp
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9/14/2017 4:21pm
There has always been suspicion of testers for decades going back to Super Hunky.

When race teams test different items, do you think they go by feel or lap times?
IceMan446
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9/14/2017 4:26pm
Motofinne wrote:
Nope. The YZF250 got 4th or 3rd in the Vital shootout depending on how you look at the KTM and Husqvarna(if you rank them as the...
Nope. The YZF250 got 4th or 3rd in the Vital shootout depending on how you look at the KTM and Husqvarna(if you rank them as the same bike). I wouldn't call that as a bike that sucks.
So fourth out of six and every other mag had it rated higher?

You remember the beating ML took for the rank the bike got?

All I'm saying is this, its a one day thing with different guys. Lap times don't mean shit at ONE track. Sure one bike might work better at one track than another. Thats very common.

Multiple tracks multiple days. Seems more reliable and a better indicator of what bike is really the best.

And better yet, listen to the "living with" podcasts Keefer does after he has spent a ton of time on the bike, tested different parts, suspension and the like. And it comes from a guy who tests for the Factory, not the teams for the actual Brands, it doesn't get better than that. Thats the real break down and he is honest regardless of the color.
ob
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9/14/2017 4:36pm Edited Date/Time 9/14/2017 4:46pm
Anybody who doesn't rate the Yamaha last is a wierd fucker. 6'5" or smaller move along. I love all of Keefers pod casts, yes I've listened to all of them even the ktm off road bike one. But I sense a little bias sometimes. Guess that's why there are lots of testers.
I really like the living with stuff he does. these shoot outs are all way to superficial.
Motofinne
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9/14/2017 4:40pm
Motofinne wrote:
Nope. The YZF250 got 4th or 3rd in the Vital shootout depending on how you look at the KTM and Husqvarna(if you rank them as the...
Nope. The YZF250 got 4th or 3rd in the Vital shootout depending on how you look at the KTM and Husqvarna(if you rank them as the same bike). I wouldn't call that as a bike that sucks.
IceMan446 wrote:
So fourth out of six and every other mag had it rated higher? You remember the beating ML took for the rank the bike got? All...
So fourth out of six and every other mag had it rated higher?

You remember the beating ML took for the rank the bike got?

All I'm saying is this, its a one day thing with different guys. Lap times don't mean shit at ONE track. Sure one bike might work better at one track than another. Thats very common.

Multiple tracks multiple days. Seems more reliable and a better indicator of what bike is really the best.

And better yet, listen to the "living with" podcasts Keefer does after he has spent a ton of time on the bike, tested different parts, suspension and the like. And it comes from a guy who tests for the Factory, not the teams for the actual Brands, it doesn't get better than that. Thats the real break down and he is honest regardless of the color.
Well whatever, all i'm going to say is that i find it amazing that the YZF450 won a shootout in 2017.

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