JGR Trouble sound testing

blair683
Profile picture for user blair683
Posts
208
Joined
9/8/2011
Location
Newton Falls, OH US
blair683
Edited Date/Time 2/11/2012 8:42pm
Haha Chad just tweeted "good thing there isant a maximum number of time you can sound test because the jgr boys would be out" damn them jgr fmf silencers must be loud and it must be hard to tone em' down.
|
RACEGUY
Profile picture for user RACEGUY
Posts
1894
Joined
8/25/2009
Location
Moncton CA
RACEGUY 1/14/2012 9:17am
1/14/2012 9:17am
Happens all the time. Flunking a few sound checks isn't big news.
FHKRacingZ
Profile picture for user FHKRacingZ
Posts
299
Joined
10/28/2006
Location
Boise, ID US
FHKRacingZ 1/14/2012 9:17am
1/14/2012 9:17am
No. Many teams try multiple different setups with headpipes,midpipes, and back up mufflers. You only have tech open for a certain time so you need to get multiple setups ran through tech while you can.
MtnBoy
Profile picture for user MtnBoy
Posts
1080
Joined
10/8/2011
Location
ID US
MtnBoy 1/14/2012 9:24am
1/14/2012 9:24am
Sounds to me like they are taking the opportunity to test as many set ups as possible.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, JGR is going to take this sport to a new level equipment wise.
RACEGUY
Profile picture for user RACEGUY
Posts
1894
Joined
8/25/2009
Location
Moncton CA
RACEGUY 1/14/2012 9:27am
1/14/2012 9:27am
There's a lot more to exhaust note than just the pipe and silencer. An exhaust system that passed last week could be a total failure the next if you've changed airbox shape or volume, cylinder compression ratio, timing advance, valve lift and duration, and in particular, valve overlap.

Also, some day, someone will spill the beans on all the little games they play during sound testing. That might be the most interesting technical "tell all" to come along in years.

The Shop

See All »
TbonesPop
Profile picture for user TbonesPop
Posts
3469
Joined
1/26/2010
Location
Gilbert, AZ US
Fantasy
321st
TbonesPop 1/14/2012 9:27am
1/14/2012 9:27am
MtnBoy wrote:
Sounds to me like they are taking the opportunity to test as many set ups as possible. I've said it before and I'll say it again...
Sounds to me like they are taking the opportunity to test as many set ups as possible.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, JGR is going to take this sport to a new level equipment wise.
Agreed, JGR is great for our sport.
pmcc
Profile picture for user pmcc
Posts
720
Joined
9/17/2006
Location
Lisburn GB
pmcc 1/14/2012 9:38am
1/14/2012 9:38am
I don't get all this hype around jgr? With the production rule all they can do is adjust things here and there, its not like they can build a one off engine and use it or a special frame... all they can do is adjust the same things as any other team.

To me it was a bigger deal when Cosworth ( the F1 engine company) joined forces with Dixon Yamaha in the GP's because they can do what ever they want to the engine.
kongols
Profile picture for user kongols
Posts
23997
Joined
9/22/2009
Location
Riga LV
kongols 1/14/2012 9:40am
1/14/2012 9:40am
I think they cheating again. lol
MtnBoy
Profile picture for user MtnBoy
Posts
1080
Joined
10/8/2011
Location
ID US
MtnBoy 1/14/2012 9:41am
1/14/2012 9:41am
pmcc wrote:
I don't get all this hype around jgr? With the production rule all they can do is adjust things here and there, its not like they...
I don't get all this hype around jgr? With the production rule all they can do is adjust things here and there, its not like they can build a one off engine and use it or a special frame... all they can do is adjust the same things as any other team.

To me it was a bigger deal when Cosworth ( the F1 engine company) joined forces with Dixon Yamaha in the GP's because they can do what ever they want to the engine.
How about the fact that they use a hand built shock that they designed?

Know of any other AMA teams doing that?

I also don't think many other teams have the resources to build the tank/airbox/shroud combo that James' bike has.
leighracer
Profile picture for user leighracer
Posts
115
Joined
7/25/2009
Location
Murrieta, CA US
leighracer 1/14/2012 9:49am
1/14/2012 9:49am
Jgr needs to build JS7 an internal gyroscope with longer battery life. It needs to stay powered up for the whole 20 lap main! Sorry for thread jacking!
pmcc
Profile picture for user pmcc
Posts
720
Joined
9/17/2006
Location
Lisburn GB
pmcc 1/14/2012 9:58am
1/14/2012 9:58am
MtnBoy wrote:
How about the fact that they use a hand built shock that they designed? Know of any other AMA teams doing that? I also don't think...
How about the fact that they use a hand built shock that they designed?

Know of any other AMA teams doing that?

I also don't think many other teams have the resources to build the tank/airbox/shroud combo that James' bike has.
but what difference has that shock made to the yamaha's? what difference is that to ohlins building a shock?

Believe me I think KTM would be able to knock up a tank and shroud combo, and again this is not going to drastically change the engineering and physics of the bike. If the bike has a horrible frame in production trim it is not like JGR can change it!?

I think there biggest asset is bringing big sponsers from nascar to mx but apart from that i don't see what they can change that a Factory Honda, KTM etc can't?
RACEGUY
Profile picture for user RACEGUY
Posts
1894
Joined
8/25/2009
Location
Moncton CA
RACEGUY 1/14/2012 9:59am
1/14/2012 9:59am
I was going to say "what is it that people don't get about the "production" rule?"...but it appears a lot of people just don't get it at all.

There is an inexhaustable variety of items a talented team like JGR can create, fabricate, modify, and re-think on that so-called "production" bike.
Drew580
Profile picture for user Drew580
Posts
167
Joined
1/27/2011
Location
CA
Drew580 1/14/2012 9:59am
1/14/2012 9:59am
RACEGUY wrote:
There's a lot more to exhaust note than just the pipe and silencer. An exhaust system that passed last week could be a total failure the...
There's a lot more to exhaust note than just the pipe and silencer. An exhaust system that passed last week could be a total failure the next if you've changed airbox shape or volume, cylinder compression ratio, timing advance, valve lift and duration, and in particular, valve overlap.

Also, some day, someone will spill the beans on all the little games they play during sound testing. That might be the most interesting technical "tell all" to come along in years.
I wonder if teams put a different ignition map in the bike (like retarding the timing) to make it quieter, because how would they know if you switched the maps before or after sound test
Sherwood
Profile picture for user Sherwood
Posts
3690
Joined
5/12/2010
Location
US
Sherwood 1/14/2012 10:01am
1/14/2012 10:01am
Same thing happened to Factory Connection last year.
RACEGUY
Profile picture for user RACEGUY
Posts
1894
Joined
8/25/2009
Location
Moncton CA
RACEGUY 1/14/2012 10:07am
1/14/2012 10:07am
Drew580 wrote:
I wonder if teams put a different ignition map in the bike (like retarding the timing) to make it quieter, because how would they know if...
I wonder if teams put a different ignition map in the bike (like retarding the timing) to make it quieter, because how would they know if you switched the maps before or after sound test
Absolutely! As I said, the games played during sound testing are infinite and MOST interesting.

Something I found surprising is a brand new or freshly packed silencer may be louder than they are after a few minutes of break-in.

Pit Row

See All »
pmcc
Profile picture for user pmcc
Posts
720
Joined
9/17/2006
Location
Lisburn GB
pmcc 1/14/2012 10:12am
1/14/2012 10:12am Edited Date/Time 1/14/2012 10:13am
RACEGUY wrote:
I was going to say "what is it that people don't get about the "production" rule?"...but it appears a lot of people just don't get it...
I was going to say "what is it that people don't get about the "production" rule?"...but it appears a lot of people just don't get it at all.

There is an inexhaustable variety of items a talented team like JGR can create, fabricate, modify, and re-think on that so-called "production" bike.
My point is what is there that they can create or rethink to drastically change the production bike that a KTM or HRC cant?
SteveS
Profile picture for user SteveS
Posts
5600
Joined
8/16/2006
Location
WV US
SteveS 1/14/2012 10:17am
1/14/2012 10:17am
pmcc wrote:
I don't get all this hype around jgr? With the production rule all they can do is adjust things here and there, its not like they...
I don't get all this hype around jgr? With the production rule all they can do is adjust things here and there, its not like they can build a one off engine and use it or a special frame... all they can do is adjust the same things as any other team.

To me it was a bigger deal when Cosworth ( the F1 engine company) joined forces with Dixon Yamaha in the GP's because they can do what ever they want to the engine.
MtnBoy wrote:
How about the fact that they use a hand built shock that they designed? Know of any other AMA teams doing that? I also don't think...
How about the fact that they use a hand built shock that they designed?

Know of any other AMA teams doing that?

I also don't think many other teams have the resources to build the tank/airbox/shroud combo that James' bike has.
Really it isn't quite that way. They had a shock built by the company that makes their NASCAR shocks. The "handbuiltness" comes from the fact that that company didn't already make shocks that size and shape. Not that JGR made it themselves out in the shop.
Toste
Profile picture for user Toste
Posts
371
Joined
5/24/2009
Location
Pahrump, NV US
Fantasy
794th
Toste 1/14/2012 10:19am
1/14/2012 10:19am
pmcc wrote:
I don't get all this hype around jgr? With the production rule all they can do is adjust things here and there, its not like they...
I don't get all this hype around jgr? With the production rule all they can do is adjust things here and there, its not like they can build a one off engine and use it or a special frame... all they can do is adjust the same things as any other team.

To me it was a bigger deal when Cosworth ( the F1 engine company) joined forces with Dixon Yamaha in the GP's because they can do what ever they want to the engine.
I agree about the hype. 4 years to figure out that an elite rider is the most important ingredient in winning a title? Not really that impressive when you take into account that L&M and TwoTwo were contending for championships in year one. Unlike auto racing, exotic parts only get you so far in this game.
MtnBoy
Profile picture for user MtnBoy
Posts
1080
Joined
10/8/2011
Location
ID US
MtnBoy 1/14/2012 10:19am
1/14/2012 10:19am
Where did I say that they made it themselves?

The bottom line is, unlike every other team who just follows the "status quo" and uses things that have been in the industry for years, they go out and get what they want, exactly how they want it, from their own sources.
OW38B
Profile picture for user OW38B
Posts
3226
Joined
8/17/2006
Location
Coto de Caza, CA US
Fantasy
203rd
OW38B 1/14/2012 10:19am
1/14/2012 10:19am
Do any of you dudes read GuyB's stuff?

From A1 Pitbits:

Sound testing proved tough for a lot of teams, with about a 50/50 pass/fail ratio early on. - GuyB
MtnBoy
Profile picture for user MtnBoy
Posts
1080
Joined
10/8/2011
Location
ID US
MtnBoy 1/14/2012 10:21am
1/14/2012 10:21am
Toste wrote:
I agree about the hype. 4 years to figure out that an elite rider is the most important ingredient in winning a title? Not really that...
I agree about the hype. 4 years to figure out that an elite rider is the most important ingredient in winning a title? Not really that impressive when you take into account that L&M and TwoTwo were contending for championships in year one. Unlike auto racing, exotic parts only get you so far in this game.
I think they had it figured out in year one that it took a top rider, just took a few years to prove themselves and land one.

I'm sure 22 motorsports had to do a ton of negotiating to get there top rider.

L&M got handed Factory Yamahas from the start, pretty easy to convince a top guy to ride those...
MtnBoy
Profile picture for user MtnBoy
Posts
1080
Joined
10/8/2011
Location
ID US
MtnBoy 1/14/2012 10:23am
1/14/2012 10:23am
OW38B wrote:
Do any of you dudes read GuyB's stuff? From A1 Pitbits: [i]Sound testing proved tough for a lot of teams, with about a 50/50 pass/fail ratio...
Do any of you dudes read GuyB's stuff?

From A1 Pitbits:

Sound testing proved tough for a lot of teams, with about a 50/50 pass/fail ratio early on. - GuyB
I'm sure they read it, people just like to find any way to shit on Stewart possible, bashing on JGR is just going to be the new way to do that this year.

And for the record, I'm not much of a Stewart fan (Go RV!) but the lack of respect he gets from people on here is pretty irritating to me.
Hando
Profile picture for user Hando
Posts
1571
Joined
11/13/2011
Location
US
Hando 1/14/2012 10:34am
1/14/2012 10:34am
JGR does more than just build a shock and put some custom shrouds on

NASCAR has restrictive rules like AMA mx/sx and they have an army of engineers to work around these rules

I think what JGR is doing is cool and their engineers are well versed in riding the limit of the rule book Smile
zippy895
Profile picture for user zippy895
Posts
5495
Joined
7/15/2008
Location
Daytona Beach, FL US
zippy895 1/14/2012 10:49am
1/14/2012 10:49am
jgr went thru this sound ck fail at rd1 as well........just saying.
wet paint
Profile picture for user wet paint
Posts
404
Joined
7/15/2008
Location
Chesnee, SC US
wet paint 1/14/2012 10:51am
1/14/2012 10:51am
The rear shock is built and sold by JRI in Mooresville, N.C. Got the 25cent tour a few weeks ago. I was told anyone can purchase it.
rustytrombone 1/14/2012 10:57am
1/14/2012 10:57am
MtnBoy wrote:
How about the fact that they use a hand built shock that they designed? Know of any other AMA teams doing that? I also don't think...
How about the fact that they use a hand built shock that they designed?

Know of any other AMA teams doing that?

I also don't think many other teams have the resources to build the tank/airbox/shroud combo that James' bike has.
This is what I don't get. Shouldn't at least the factory teams be capable of that type of stuff, and some of the bigger sattelite teams (ie PC, Geico)? I don't have anything against JGR, but it seems to me that they get a ton of press about what they can do, but aside from Josh Grant's Anaheim win they haven't produced results.
kongols
Profile picture for user kongols
Posts
23997
Joined
9/22/2009
Location
Riga LV
kongols 1/14/2012 11:00am
1/14/2012 11:00am
Just wait till RaceFace gets here.lol

Post a reply to: JGR Trouble sound testing