Is ML512 high?

TeamPumpin
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11/15/2016 7:55pm
Currently listening to Pulp, and that is the question of the night. I, for one totally agree that Michael and his posse of goon riders must be tested for narcotics. Yes, I heard him call in and give his so called explanation. But I don't buy it. No one in their right state of mind will put the YZ250F FOURTH. FOURTH?? This is almost worth a protest.
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twotwosix
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TN US
11/15/2016 7:59pm Edited Date/Time 11/15/2016 8:01pm
The KTM twins are clearly better. So no. And if Yamaha really screwed up the forks on the '17s, than sure, its possible that the 2017 Kawi is better. I don't ride many 250Fs, but I have spent time on the new Kawi 450 and if the 250 feels similar, I could see it.
kiwifan
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11/15/2016 8:03pm
It is the Vital shootout team's perspective, not everyone will agree with it but I find Vital's shootouts much more honest than others. So yeah I believe them.
malachi177
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11/15/2016 8:05pm
Do you read??Blink If so, read over the 250f shootout that was posted here last week. It explains it all.
gsxr6
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11/15/2016 8:05pm Edited Date/Time 11/15/2016 8:07pm
The kawi makes the same power within a half a horse of the yzf. It clearly has a better chassis than the previous model. Could I see it handling better than the yzf? Well that's not that high of a target lol

The Shop

gsxr6
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11/15/2016 8:06pm
And the ktm make 4 more hp. Power is always rewarded with shootout wins in that class.
ML512
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Wildomar, CA US
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36th
11/15/2016 8:08pm
TeamPumpin wrote:
Currently listening to Pulp, and that is the question of the night. I, for one totally agree that Michael and his posse of goon riders must...
Currently listening to Pulp, and that is the question of the night. I, for one totally agree that Michael and his posse of goon riders must be tested for narcotics. Yes, I heard him call in and give his so called explanation. But I don't buy it. No one in their right state of mind will put the YZ250F FOURTH. FOURTH?? This is almost worth a protest.
Even though weed is now legal in California I am most certainly not high. For the record, I placed the Yamaha third on my personal list. I had five other guys other than myself hit the same conclusion. No one in my group is allowed to talk about the bikes during the test, and their notes mirrored my thoughts.
colintrax
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Taylorsville, GA US
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2302nd
11/15/2016 8:09pm
The orange/white, and green bikes are very good. But thanks for letting us know you ride a yami
gsxr6
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Anderson, CA US
11/15/2016 8:09pm
I rode a buddy's 12 kx250f a couple months back. Waaay faster than I expected( hadn't touched a 250f since a buddy's 07 rmz in late 06. Hated that bike it was sooooo slow).
gsxr6
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11/15/2016 8:21pm
Besides it's in its fourth model year , so moving back in the shootout gives them a reason to aim higher next year right? The bike won most shootouts the first couple years.
51xc
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DE
11/15/2016 8:22pm
so what's the problem here? if you like the yz, go and buy it. Blink
gsxr6
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11/15/2016 8:28pm
The rmz and crf haven't really been updated since that yzf arrived in 14. The kx and the Austrian twins have.
JW381
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Harrisburg, OR US
11/15/2016 8:40pm
He's not "high" he just reached a heightened state of consciousness by tapping into his universal matter, channeling his inner star dust lineage. He can also talk to plants and cats now.
MX Guy
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773rd
11/15/2016 8:55pm
Is this real
Idp57
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Arlington Heights, IL US
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11/15/2016 9:15pm
I like Steve,but some times ,like 50% of the time ..he is saying some really stupid stuff to make some drama.Thats why its a show.Read the shootout first .Really good one!!!
Jarrod458
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Youngstown, OH US
11/15/2016 10:28pm
gsxr6 wrote:
I rode a buddy's 12 kx250f a couple months back. Waaay faster than I expected( hadn't touched a 250f since a buddy's 07 rmz in late...
I rode a buddy's 12 kx250f a couple months back. Waaay faster than I expected( hadn't touched a 250f since a buddy's 07 rmz in late 06. Hated that bike it was sooooo slow).
12 was the first year for Kaws duel fuel injector! Great engine! Still can't believe no other 250f has caught on to that.
Motofinne
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FI
11/15/2016 11:31pm
I haven't listened to the nights show yet but i trust the Vital Shootout.

Yamaha YZ250F got 4th, end of story. It is still a great bike but there might be even better options in 2017 in the likes of KTM, Husky and Kawasaki. That being said some might still think that the Yamaha is the number one bike and that is great for them!
Pirate421
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MA US
11/16/2016 2:39am
I listen to that show every week but I was pretty annoyed with that whole conversation. Good on ML for keeping his cool I sure wouldn't have. The main reason why I don't buy dirt rider mag is because of listening to keefer on the show. I don't dislike him but he doesn't have much credibility with me and how biased he is with yamahas and mx in general. The dude works and tests for an off road magazine that has several times featured less mainstream bikes like betas, and he says on the show he's never even ridden one when asked about it. This is just one example but if all I did for work was ride dirtbikes for a magazine I'd make it a priority to ride them all and become familiar with them if I went on a dirtbike podcast and took questions regularly from riders. If it's not about yamahas or spring forks forget about it.

I've never put much stock in magazine reviews since they argue that their test riders are all pros. Most if not all people who read those tests are not pros and have vastly varying opinions of the bikes than the testers anyway. Maybe pros are better at dissecting what a bike does or doesn't do but I'd rather hear from an average joe since that's what most of us are. I can't see any pros looking to a magazine test to find out more about their next bike purchase.
Motofinne
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11/16/2016 3:43am Edited Date/Time 11/16/2016 3:46am
Just listened to it. So the very Yamaha biased Keefer and the journalist that never ever rides think that ML and the test riders are crazy?

ML did good on that interview, kept his composure!

YZ250F getting 4th is a surprise but if all the test riders thought that the KTM, Husky and Kawasaki were better then they probably was better. Especially if the test riders were the same as in 2016?
tempura
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JP
11/16/2016 3:52am
I have to say, 4th is about right for the Yamaha this year.
A big part of the pulp show is creating drama to keep people interested, and that's what they do.
Idp57
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Arlington Heights, IL US
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11/16/2016 4:23am
If you wanna be funny,you have to know when to stop being funny!!!
11/16/2016 4:48am
With all of the bikes being so close in performance now, is 4th out of 6 really that bad?
11/16/2016 4:53am
51xc wrote:
so what's the problem here? if you like the yz, go and buy it. Blink
Common sense will not be allowed here.

Michael, great test work from you and the crew involved. Though I currently own and ride two Yamahas (albeit 2-strokes) I am no longer a high-school kid arguing at lunch with my friends thusly;

Honda!

No, Suzuki rules!

No way, man...YAMAHA is king!

That was a long time ago. I do believe Yamaha builds a quality machine for the most part, but frame cracks on all models and third gear problems with the 2-stroke 250 (see my post in Tech Help/Race Shop) have sharply reduced my enthusiasm for the brand.

Honestly, for all of us weekend warriors, just pick your favorite color. KTM/Husky has earned the #1 spot by being innovative and listening to the customer. No machine is perfect (yet), but from everything I've been reading, the little company in Austria is working hard to get there.
OldYZRider1
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Bushnell, IL US
11/16/2016 5:41am


Do we need to wear these for the Yamaha guys?
bvm111
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11/16/2016 5:46am
[img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2016/11/16/160245/s1200_Blue_Safety_Pin.jpg[/img] Do we need to wear these for the Yamaha guys?


Do we need to wear these for the Yamaha guys?
WoohooWoohooWoohooWoohooWoohooWoohoo
MxRyder
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Las Vegas, NV US
11/16/2016 6:35am
I am a yamaha owner..(2) 450s. 14'&15.....(1)250 2stroke 14'....ive rode 14'&15 &17250f.....they all are great bikes.....but i could see where the ktm and very well the kawi has stepped up....frame geometry and design....the yamaha are starting to feel heavier...and wider compared to the other 3.....ktm/hus/kaw......we already know yamaha makes a mean motor and the suspension is good.....but weight is becoming a factor and the width.......i rode a16&17ktm 350 stock...just took about 10laps to get the suspension and geometry step up in the desired ball park (forkheight-sag-rear axle)...and it was one of the best bikes ive ever ridden....my opinion 1 tooth on the rear and it will out perform all 450s...with 1/2the effort......its so easy to ride it feels like cheating.....Now, this is where i finally can see the advances the other bikes are making......the reality is technology is coming down to the frames....and it shows...Yamaha was the class leader from 14'-16'...and 16" was a close call for many.....yamaha need to step up.....Ktm is moving forward at incrediable rate....and their coat tailed husky along the way some say even better.....kawi woke up......this is the nature of technology....And from all the conversations at comp edge with K.Keefer of DR the new Honda is very similar to the Yz450 but revs longer,thinner,lighter and just everything improved on in which i was wanting from the yz450....Yamaha just needs to move it ass,or it will fall behind as it did in 12'-13'....i like everything about the Yz line...however cracked frames,and a fellow rider just sent me a pic of his 16' broken in two pieces from the spares broke clear off from the steering head.....the bike is to heavy....and i can say im starting to form a decision to change brands
tempura
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JP
11/16/2016 6:51am
If Matthes was able to swing his obesely fat ass over a yz250f and ride it, I'm sure it would be a great test of endurance for the frame welds and bike in general...lol
seth505
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SD, CA US
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1048th
11/16/2016 6:53am Edited Date/Time 11/16/2016 6:54am
I thought that if you read the shootout rather than just look at all the final rankings, it was a great shootout and spelled things out for the reader. I didn't listen to this pulp episode but it sounds like it was annoying.

While we are all armchair quarterbacking....hell, look at Deano in those vids testing the Yamaha 450, it sure doesn't look like it hits corners as graceful as the KTM.
TeamGreen
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Thru-out, CA US
11/16/2016 7:30am
When the stock chassis set-up takes a GIANT STEP backward...you rate it as such.

If people can read, they can see exactly how and why these conclusions were reached.

How'd they rate the Yamaha engine ?
TeamGreen
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11/16/2016 7:33am
tempura wrote:
I have to say, 4th is about right for the Yamaha this year. A big part of the pulp show is creating drama to keep people...
I have to say, 4th is about right for the Yamaha this year.
A big part of the pulp show is creating drama to keep people interested, and that's what they do.
Boom!
opyguy
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567
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Boston, MA US
11/16/2016 7:59am
late to the show old guy rider, probably don't fit the ideal demographic for Vital (over 40 vet), but in any event:

Subscribe to MXA and DR, have to say I love Vital.
Don't know if ML owns the website or is just an employee but he does a great job, very detailed, in-depth reviews. DR's shootouts tend to be a joke, I do enjoy MXA's though. Another guy I think does a great job is Pat Foster, similar to ML, seems to be thoughtful and concise.
Enough of the man love, just wanted to say thanks to ML you do a good job.

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