Posts
365
Joined
9/14/2016
Location
AU
...and anyone in the 250 class can ride any 250cc either two stroke (2T) or four stroke (4T).
What happens next? Would the smokers be competitive indoors? Would some pros choose to ride 4T indoors and 2T outdoors? Riders running 4T for dry, skatey West coast SX rounds, and 2T for East coast rounds with better traction?
Has anyone here raced both 250 2T and 4T in the same class? I know that some 2T riders had great results in the AUS Nationals a few years ago, but it has kind of leveled off now with 2T unable to run a decent level of modifications.
This is just for fun. For the record, I own a YZ125 (love it on clay tracks and tight turns) and a YZ450F (sand track weapon). I'll continue to have smokers and thumpers. Different horses for different courses.
What happens next? Would the smokers be competitive indoors? Would some pros choose to ride 4T indoors and 2T outdoors? Riders running 4T for dry, skatey West coast SX rounds, and 2T for East coast rounds with better traction?
Has anyone here raced both 250 2T and 4T in the same class? I know that some 2T riders had great results in the AUS Nationals a few years ago, but it has kind of leveled off now with 2T unable to run a decent level of modifications.
This is just for fun. For the record, I own a YZ125 (love it on clay tracks and tight turns) and a YZ450F (sand track weapon). I'll continue to have smokers and thumpers. Different horses for different courses.
The Shop
I like all the bikes but I would really love to see the rules change so that the sport is more affordable for everyone.
As for MX Nationals here in Australia, Hamish Harwood is going to race both classes this year, on a 250 two stroke in MX2 and a 300cc two stroke in MX1. That is insane just thinking about it. Interesting to see how he goes. I haven't seen riders racing both classes for 20 years.
If so that is insane, I struggle with the two 30 minutes alone
I had been thinking recently about the pace of development, rider comfort and riding style for the 4T machines and wondering whether the 2T would still have such a big advantage these days. Again, I do not care either way and I appreciate the lack of ranting so far in this thread.
Yamaha and KTM/Husky don't have any trouble selling 2T's so why give them away on race plans and give the public the impression that they might be better. It doesn't work for the manufacturers to have 2Ts on the podium either.
Add to that the fact that there is a perception that you need to win on a 4T if you want to make it to Europe or the States and you have a reason why there seems to be less and less 2T's at the nationals. The only bright light is the 125 scene is growing.
Edit. I don't think the 4T's are any slower or faster, but I do know what is better for the sport and the fans.
I'd be surprised if Yamaha, or KTM / KTHusky, offered anything near (or indeed, Any ) the 'race / dealer' prices on the 2ts that they do with 4t 'deals'.
Hell, did you notice in a recent ADB issue the comparison between 250 2t and 4t 'costs' that the 2T bike Itself cost $200 more to buy than the 250F . US customers might just be surprised by that - we have been being royally ripped off here in OZ for years now.
And, simply, you've only got 2 ( well, I consider the KTHuskies as being completely integral with KTM) Big manufacturers with 2ts on offer for MX. You've got the other 3 Big manufacturers with No full sized 2ts. So people are surprised by more 4ts being out there?
250 vs 250 , well, every capacity vs the same capacity limit - 4ts stopped being low tech trail bikes nearly 2 decades ago.
There is No need for handicap / sheltered workshop classing for 4ts. They can compete with a 2t, and they have much more to come. Just as 2ts have, if developed further.
Hopefully, the new EMX250 equivalency rules stay / are actually implemented, and the main manufacturers influence is given far less precedence, over the general health of the sport.
Your third sentence is a very relevant one - inarguable, actually. Perhaps (the hopeful) progression of the EMX2 rules will help with that - but really, I don't hold out much hope for that - Honda, especially, will fight equivalency in World MX, and US Pro Racing to the death, I reckon. F**ked, is the simplest way to describe their corporate attitude.
I have / have had both types of ICE engined bikes - love both - currently ride, on dirt, more 2ts than 4ts. All I want to see is no More BS capacity rules, in any level / type of racing.
On average it wont matter what bike a guy is on, they will turn roughly the same lap times, but a 250 2t will have more power for getting over obstacles. If you can triple vs doubling you save more time and the burst of power can be what you need for making a pass
Pit Row
Some tracks will suit each machine better, but that is INTERESTING. There are multiple examples in motorsports where difference creates interest...
We've seen it in Aus and Canada, we'll see it in europe this year. The best rider will win. Not the best bike.
AND before anyone loses their mind about the MFGs pulling out because they did in road racing. They won't. Dirt bikes are a specialised R&D process. Road bikes are a transport tool. They don't need to road race or MotoGP to make a kickass bike. Case in point, the GSXR1000 and 750 were best in class for years that they didn't do either.
You can't do that for dirt bikes tho. Too specialised. No MFG is going to walk from that investment into their production line because of a rule change, they didn't in the late 90s, they won't now...
The sport 100% needs a class change. 500s went the way of the dodo bird, the sooner 250s are the class limit and we bring back small displacement racing the healthier the sport will be.
Amateurs need to be able to get in without engine investments. Bums at your local track need to buy $100 helmets, not leave the sport because their 4 stroke blew up. They'll rebuild a two stroke themselves or cheaply but no-one wants a bill for 2 grand.
I especially agree with....."There is No need for handicap / sheltered workshop classing for 4ts. They can compete with a 2t, and they have much more to come. Just as 2ts have, if developed further."
It's a shame really that the world of Pro MX/SX racing is manipulated by one big manufacturer.
It could be so much better for all of us.
Let me preface by saying I'm 100% in favor of the notion of equal displacement across the board, including the 450's. Let the best motor win.
That said, the trap I see is having to have two complete setups, because certain tracks will favor 2 strokes and some will favor 4. One isn't necessarily "harder" to ride than the other, they are just suited to different things. A 4 stroke is certainly easier on hard pack as it's more tractable. In deep sand though, I'd take a 2 stroke any day of the week.
It's horses for courses.
Post a reply to: Hypothetical: the 250 rules change tomorrow...