Full Floater back in production!

wreckitrandy
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wreckitrandy
Edited Date/Time 1/26/2012 2:27pm
On a Victory street bike. Except it's turned kinda sideways. Same idea though. Wonder how the patent thing will work here.Unsure
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stillwelding
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stillwelding 5/26/2010 8:10pm
5/26/2010 8:10pm
wreckitrandy wrote:
On a Victory street bike. Except it's turned kinda sideways. Same idea though. Wonder how the patent thing will work here.Unsure
Useless without pictures.
wreckitrandy
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wreckitrandy 5/26/2010 8:13pm
5/26/2010 8:13pm
Useless with pictures as well. Unless you ride street bikes. In which case, go to a Victory dealer and watch the promo vid.
Oldskool
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Oldskool 5/26/2010 8:22pm
5/26/2010 8:22pm
The patent on Suzuki's Full Floater expired many, many years ago. I don't think there should be any concern on the part of Victory for patent considerations involving the Full Floater as we know it on a motocross bike.

wow123
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wow123 5/26/2010 9:55pm
5/26/2010 9:55pm
was/is the best system

brilliant design

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CamP
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CamP 5/26/2010 9:59pm
5/26/2010 9:59pm
wow123 wrote:
was/is the best system

brilliant design
Yep, the original RM Full Floater works as well as most modern rear suspension.
rmpilot
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rmpilot 5/26/2010 10:39pm
5/26/2010 10:39pm
how come suzuki quit using it? ive never heard anything bad about it and ive seen a very good d 16 guy go just as fast on an 81 rm 125 as anything else
Sandberm
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Sandberm 5/26/2010 11:04pm
5/26/2010 11:04pm
I think it had a lot of friction compared to what came later.
wow123
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wow123 5/26/2010 11:25pm
5/26/2010 11:25pm
rmpilot wrote:
how come suzuki quit using it? ive never heard anything bad about it and ive seen a very good d 16 guy go just as fast...
how come suzuki quit using it? ive never heard anything bad about it and ive seen a very good d 16 guy go just as fast on an 81 rm 125 as anything else
years ago when i was doing modern and vintage mx

i got a hold of a 465 put some 88 cr250 forks

all set up nice

loved that bike with that set up

could do things on it that i couldnt on my 95 kx250

DoctorJD
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DoctorJD 5/27/2010 6:18am
5/27/2010 6:18am
Trek mountain bikes licensed the design and use it, as well.


mxrose3
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mxrose3 5/27/2010 6:39am
5/27/2010 6:39am
DoctorJD wrote:
Trek mountain bikes licensed the design and use it, as well. [IMG]http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y80/DoctorJD/trek-fuel-ex-full.jpg[/IMG]
Trek mountain bikes licensed the design and use it, as well.


I don't see anything from the bottom swingarm pushing up on the shock on this picture.
The real Full Floater had the bottom of the shock mounted to the swingarm before the pivot point, so it actually pushed up on the bottom of the shock also.
I remember reading that Suzuki abandoned the idea because of the costs associated with the system, and the simpler Honda 'pro-link' style was what everyone was going to because of that.
DoctorJD
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DoctorJD 5/27/2010 7:08am
5/27/2010 7:08am Edited Date/Time 4/17/2016 11:08pm
The shock is mounted to the swingarm in the picture, its just hard to see. It is, however, mounted on the other side of the swingarm pivot. Here's a better picture:


You're right, this design doesn't seem to applying the same amount of progressive force that Suzuki's design did, but I guess the principals are the same.
mxrose3
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mxrose3 5/27/2010 7:12am
5/27/2010 7:12am
DoctorJD wrote:
The shock is mounted to the swingarm in the picture, its just hard to see. It is, however, mounted on the other side of the swingarm...
The shock is mounted to the swingarm in the picture, its just hard to see. It is, however, mounted on the other side of the swingarm pivot. Here's a better picture:


You're right, this design doesn't seem to applying the same amount of progressive force that Suzuki's design did, but I guess the principals are the same.
Ok, that looks similar, but that would be more like a falling-rate instead of a rising-rate setup.
The bottom of that swingarm is going to slowly retract away from the shock instead of compress the shock. Pretty cool looking though.
captmoto
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captmoto 5/27/2010 8:24am
5/27/2010 8:24am
I think Suzuki said production costs and maint cost. Who really knows, things are always changing.
pie8man
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pie8man 5/27/2010 9:00am
5/27/2010 9:00am
It is still a rising rate setup as the top of the shock will travel down faster than the bottom. One of the other problems with this for moto is that it adds additional unsprung weight because the entire shock has to move for the suspension to compress. Unsprung weight has a big impact on initial shock movement which is what we are most sensitive on the MX bikes. In addition putting all the linkage above the swingarm full floater style makes for a higher center of gravity. The link design we have now is very efficient, very low CG and has endless leverage ratio options.
hellion
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hellion 5/27/2010 9:04am
5/27/2010 9:04am
To this day I haven't ridden a rear suspension that worked as well as the Full FLoater did. Maybe that's because it was such a huge step up from what we rode before it. I have an old RM500 I'm going to eventually restore just to see how good it really was or is.
Tiki
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Tiki 5/27/2010 9:10am
5/27/2010 9:10am
captmoto wrote:
I think Suzuki said production costs and maint cost. Who really knows, things are always changing.
From what I have read about it, it had a lot to do with production costs, also mechanical costs. Additionally it takes up a lot of room. The task could be accomplished using less room and overall lighter weight. I do agree it is the second best suspension to the AMP link.

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pie8man
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pie8man 5/27/2010 9:11am
5/27/2010 9:11am
I think I just got called a turd? That aint right!!
wreckitrandy
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wreckitrandy 5/27/2010 11:03am
5/27/2010 11:03am
Full Floater design compresses the shock from both ends.
Blake
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Blake 5/27/2010 11:19am
5/27/2010 11:19am
Its not about cost when the bikes are 9 grand as it is now.

9 grand for a dirt bike?Whats a few hundred either way?
With 30 year old technology that is marginally, if any at all, better.

They just now got EFI. That right there is 18-19 years old technology, and quads have had it for years as well.

Quads got it before dirt bikes? WTF?
rmpilot
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rmpilot 5/27/2010 5:31pm
5/27/2010 5:31pm
Blake wrote:
Its not about cost when the bikes are 9 grand as it is now. 9 grand for a dirt bike?Whats a few hundred either way? With...
Its not about cost when the bikes are 9 grand as it is now.

9 grand for a dirt bike?Whats a few hundred either way?
With 30 year old technology that is marginally, if any at all, better.

They just now got EFI. That right there is 18-19 years old technology, and quads have had it for years as well.

Quads got it before dirt bikes? WTF?
well motocross bikes suffer about as much abuse as anything else and extreme conditions. so im thinking they just wait until the the weight is down, durability is worth it and performs right. so thats what im thinking but i could be wrong.
TeamGreen
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TeamGreen 5/27/2010 6:26pm
5/27/2010 6:26pm Edited Date/Time 4/17/2016 11:09pm
wreckitrandy wrote:
Full Floater design compresses the shock from both ends.
& it was all aft of the pivot, wasn't it?
uk125250
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uk125250 5/27/2010 6:34pm
5/27/2010 6:34pm
rmpilot wrote:
well motocross bikes suffer about as much abuse as anything else and extreme conditions. so im thinking they just wait until the the weight is down...
well motocross bikes suffer about as much abuse as anything else and extreme conditions. so im thinking they just wait until the the weight is down, durability is worth it and performs right. so thats what im thinking but i could be wrong.
Quad guys are ridiculously rough on those things.
czernik
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czernik 5/27/2010 8:27pm
5/27/2010 8:27pm Edited Date/Time 4/17/2016 11:10pm
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rmpilot
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rmpilot 5/27/2010 10:21pm
5/27/2010 10:21pm
rmpilot wrote:
well motocross bikes suffer about as much abuse as anything else and extreme conditions. so im thinking they just wait until the the weight is down...
well motocross bikes suffer about as much abuse as anything else and extreme conditions. so im thinking they just wait until the the weight is down, durability is worth it and performs right. so thats what im thinking but i could be wrong.
uk125250 wrote:
Quad guys are ridiculously rough on those things.
maybe they just treated it as a proving ground with fuel injection?

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