Emig's intensity comment...

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Barrett57

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6/11/2012 9:59 AM
Edited Date/Time: 6/11/2012 9:59 AM

carlosmacho wrote:

Well, things have changed in England and my perceptions may be based on old data but the fact that you guys keep changing your system is very telling, but it is still a mess with more changes coming in 2013 and further out. Talk about confusing. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Education_in_England But that is ok, I am American, I don't care about England's education system, but when comparisons come, the US is not on top because it is uneducated.

Yes, Europe is a very diverse place, and the Americans still beat your top riders. LOL

Yep, England has changed.

I used to care about who was faster, but now I just don't give a flying bejeesus.

I no longer regret my username.


Jamie_Munro

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6/11/2012 10:08 AM

Anybody using Wiki for a knowledge source requires that little extra help.

Jamie_Munro

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6/11/2012 10:12 AM

Anyway we are 4 races in, let's see how intense everybody is in a couple of races or half way through the season. It will be interesting once 70 and 38 know the tracks and their competition

moto282

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6/11/2012 10:23 AM
Edited Date/Time: 6/11/2012 10:30 AM

robkinuk wrote:

Funny how Emig and Weedge were going on and on about the intensity of Barcia, Tomac & Baggett whilst at the same time Roczen was schooling them building up a 9 sec lead, only to throw it away with a silly crash with 2 laps to go and get held up by Kyle peters before Tomac found his way through!

They were so intense, perhaps concentrating on each other too much, they nearly forgot about Roczen!

You mean when Baggett and Barcia were battling which allowed Roczen to pull out front a little bit?

How many weekends in a row are lappers going to be blamed for Roczen's mistakes? That excuse has been used in 3 out of the 4 rounds so far... Last weekend it was lappers causing him to crash in the turn... this week its another lapper causing him to briefly lay it over.

daveoevo

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6/11/2012 10:29 AM

Is it the intense racing that means just about every body is injured in the 450's?

DJL52

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6/11/2012 10:31 AM

At this level, isn't "knowing the track" a little overrated since most Pro's only ride each track once a year? Tough for anyone to know, or dial in a track with that little time on it. The Teams would have all of the other track data that is used for bike set-up.

Unless it's a riders "home" track, I don't think riding it once per year is much advantage, if any.

Just my opinion.

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6/11/2012 10:36 AM

robkinuk wrote:

Funny how Emig and Weedge were going on and on about the intensity of Barcia, Tomac & Baggett whilst at the same time Roczen was schooling them building up a 9 sec lead, only to throw it away with a silly crash with 2 laps to go and get held up by Kyle peters before Tomac found his way through!

They were so intense, perhaps concentrating on each other too much, they nearly forgot about Roczen!

moto282 wrote:

You mean when Baggett and Barcia were battling which allowed Roczen to pull out front a little bit?

How many weekends in a row are lappers going to be blamed for Roczen's mistakes? That excuse has been used in 3 out of the 4 rounds so far... Last weekend it was lappers causing him to crash in the turn... this week its another lapper causing him to briefly lay it over.

Come on man, you can't be serious. You have pointed out everything possible to belittle Roczen. The kid is doing awesome in a new experience and should only be applauded for his performances.

peelout

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6/11/2012 10:39 AM

robkinuk wrote:

Funny how Emig and Weedge were going on and on about the intensity of Barcia, Tomac & Baggett whilst at the same time Roczen was schooling them building up a 9 sec lead, only to throw it away with a silly crash with 2 laps to go and get held up by Kyle peters before Tomac found his way through!

They were so intense, perhaps concentrating on each other too much, they nearly forgot about Roczen!

moto282 wrote:

You mean when Baggett and Barcia were battling which allowed Roczen to pull out front a little bit?

How many weekends in a row are lappers going to be blamed for Roczen's mistakes? That excuse has been used in 3 out of the 4 rounds so far... Last weekend it was lappers causing him to crash in the turn... this week its another lapper causing him to briefly lay it over.

where or when did Roczen blame a lapper for making him fall this week?

did i miss it?

also, is your agenda the same if it were Roczen coming from behind and Tomac falling with a big lead?

i know, big IF, but some of you guys act like Roczen is under performing.

and yes, he did pull away from the same two guys that last week everyone was saying he was way off their pace

kcco

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6/11/2012 10:41 AM

I think the "silent majority" of US motocross fans think it's awesome that Roczen is racing here. I can't wait to see him in person at Unadilla. Even though...Tomac is my guy!

Jamie_Munro

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6/11/2012 10:50 AM

I do think track knowledge does come into it yeah, when you compare someone that is seeing it for the 1st time compared to several times. Regardless of skill level it still has a part to play, sure a pro needs less time to adjust but it's still preferable to understand how it's going to evolve and show itself over the race.

moto282

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6/11/2012 10:55 AM

peelout wrote:

where or when did Roczen blame a lapper for making him fall this week?

did i miss it?

also, is your agenda the same if it were Roczen coming from behind and Tomac falling with a big lead?

i know, big IF, but some of you guys act like Roczen is under performing.

and yes, he did pull away from the same two guys that last week everyone was saying he was way off their pace

-I didn't say Roczen blamed the lappers. People in this thread are saying it was the lappers fault (i.e. saying it was Kyle Peters).

-Yep, when Roczen wins... and he will, I would/will say the same.

-I think Roczen is doing fine and will only get better from here. I've said it in other threads. I think he just has to get his confidence back. All speculation-but I think SX got in his head a little bit. Once he wins a moto, I predict he starts winning more motos.

-What I don't agree with is taking anything away from the other 3 guys. i.e. Tomac starts in the back of the pack and catches the leaders and yet Roczen "schooled" them. That "schooling" post is what I responded to.

peelout

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6/11/2012 11:27 AM

moto282 wrote:

You mean when Baggett and Barcia were battling which allowed Roczen to pull out front a little bit?

How many weekends in a row are lappers going to be blamed for Roczen's mistakes? That excuse has been used in 3 out of the 4 rounds so far... Last weekend it was lappers causing him to crash in the turn... this week its another lapper causing him to briefly lay it over.

peelout wrote:

where or when did Roczen blame a lapper for making him fall this week?

did i miss it?

also, is your agenda the same if it were Roczen coming from behind and Tomac falling with a big lead?

i know, big IF, but some of you guys act like Roczen is under performing.

and yes, he did pull away from the same two guys that last week everyone was saying he was way off their pace

moto282 wrote:

-I didn't say Roczen blamed the lappers. People in this thread are saying it was the lappers fault (i.e. saying it was Kyle Peters).

-Yep, when Roczen wins... and he will, I would/will say the same.

-I think Roczen is doing fine and will only get better from here. I've said it in other threads. I think he just has to get his confidence back. All speculation-but I think SX got in his head a little bit. Once he wins a moto, I predict he starts winning more motos.

-What I don't agree with is taking anything away from the other 3 guys. i.e. Tomac starts in the back of the pack and catches the leaders and yet Roczen "schooled" them. That "schooling" post is what I responded to.

good response

kcco

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6/11/2012 11:34 AM
Edited Date/Time: 6/11/2012 11:35 AM

When Marv-O gets under Payton's tent, everyone's in trouble. And his podium speeches are only going to get longer and more enthusiastic.

"tell us about your win today, Marvin."

"Well you know, today I had a bowl of oatmeal, it was delicious, and...um....so many fans I think you, all my fans, I'm just really excited to be here, very excite. "

He is my favorite non-American, hands down. His enthusiasm bleed out of my television screen so much I run down to my garage, fire my bike up and panic rev it a few times before the second moto.

robkinuk

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6/11/2012 11:52 AM

moto282 wrote:

-I didn't say Roczen blamed the lappers. People in this thread are saying it was the lappers fault (i.e. saying it was Kyle Peters).

-Yep, when Roczen wins... and he will, I would/will say the same.

-I think Roczen is doing fine and will only get better from here. I've said it in other threads. I think he just has to get his confidence back. All speculation-but I think SX got in his head a little bit. Once he wins a moto, I predict he starts winning more motos.

-What I don't agree with is taking anything away from the other 3 guys. i.e. Tomac starts in the back of the pack and catches the leaders and yet Roczen "schooled" them. That "schooling" post is what I responded to.

I didn't say anything about Kyle Peters causing Roczen to crash. He just took an age to get out of the way when being lapped by Roczen & Barcia.

The intensity comments were flying thick and fast about Baggett, Barcia and Tomac whilst Roczen was quietly getting on with leading the race.

How can their intensity be at another level when Roczen was 9 sec's infront?

Taking nothing away from Tomac who had a fantastic ride through the pack, perhaps "the ride" so far in his career.

It's going to be a very interesting title battle, my money's still on Roczen. Perhaps consistancy will win out in the end?

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6/11/2012 12:20 PM

robkinuk wrote:

I didn't say anything about Kyle Peters causing Roczen to crash. He just took an age to get out of the way when being lapped by Roczen & Barcia.

The intensity comments were flying thick and fast about Baggett, Barcia and Tomac whilst Roczen was quietly getting on with leading the race.

How can their intensity be at another level when Roczen was 9 sec's infront?

Taking nothing away from Tomac who had a fantastic ride through the pack, perhaps "the ride" so far in his career.

It's going to be a very interesting title battle, my money's still on Roczen. Perhaps consistancy will win out in the end?

Tomac's intensity allowed him to win the race. The intensity of Roczen and Baggett caused them to crash, the intensity of Barcia seemed to be lacking.

"quietly getting on with leading the race"

Will Hann was leading the race like Roczen, he schooled no one, like Roczen.

"Perhaps consistancy will win out in the end?"

I said this in the first two races, and though 4th in points he still poses a threat, anything can happen, but IMHO, the top 3 Americans are schooling Roczen, Class is in, and he better learn quickly or if the others remain consistent, he will be 4th in the championship

Motocross is a contact sport

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6/11/2012 12:37 PM
Edited Date/Time: 6/11/2012 12:40 PM

Plenty of time, look how quickly the wheels can fall off, Baggett is a perfect example. They are trying hard and luck along with god damn massive levels of skill will be a huge factor b4 the season plays out in full

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6/11/2012 1:04 PM

Two Stroke Taliban wrote:

When Marv-O gets under Payton's tent, everyone's in trouble. And his podium speeches are only going to get longer and more enthusiastic.

"tell us about your win today, Marvin."

"Well you know, today I had a bowl of oatmeal, it was delicious, and...um....so many fans I think you, all my fans, I'm just really excited to be here, very excite. "

He is my favorite non-American, hands down. His enthusiasm bleed out of my television screen so much I run down to my garage, fire my bike up and panic rev it a few times before the second moto.

LMAO! U have a point as well!

carlosmacho

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6/11/2012 1:26 PM
Edited Date/Time: 6/11/2012 1:44 PM

robkinuk wrote:

I didn't say anything about Kyle Peters causing Roczen to crash. He just took an age to get out of the way when being lapped by Roczen & Barcia.

The intensity comments were flying thick and fast about Baggett, Barcia and Tomac whilst Roczen was quietly getting on with leading the race.

How can their intensity be at another level when Roczen was 9 sec's infront?

Taking nothing away from Tomac who had a fantastic ride through the pack, perhaps "the ride" so far in his career.

It's going to be a very interesting title battle, my money's still on Roczen. Perhaps consistancy will win out in the end?

The intensity comment was used by Emig in the first moto, when he expected Roczen and Musquin to kick butt based on their top qualifing times, cooler weather and Euro-style track, but they both finished more than 30 seconds behind the lead pack of Barcia, Tomac, Bagget.
Roczen even admitted to 'sandbagging' the first moto, so I think Emig's observation was spot on.

Motocross is a contact sport

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6/11/2012 1:31 PM

I'd have to agree with Emig.

Just watch the actual races.

Baggett, Barcia, and Tomac are just pushing so much harder than everyone else. Even though Rozen is crazy fast he isn't pushing it like the other front runners. Over a long reason of 24 motos this might work in his favor but in the short term they are running over him. Marvin is also super fast but zero intensity.

Watch a couple of motos and it's easy to see.

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6/11/2012 2:10 PM

robkinuk wrote:

Funny how Emig and Weedge were going on and on about the intensity of Barcia, Tomac & Baggett whilst at the same time Roczen was schooling them building up a 9 sec lead, only to throw it away with a silly crash with 2 laps to go and get held up by Kyle peters before Tomac found his way through!

They were so intense, perhaps concentrating on each other too much, they nearly forgot about Roczen!

moto282 wrote:

You mean when Baggett and Barcia were battling which allowed Roczen to pull out front a little bit?

How many weekends in a row are lappers going to be blamed for Roczen's mistakes? That excuse has been used in 3 out of the 4 rounds so far... Last weekend it was lappers causing him to crash in the turn... this week its another lapper causing him to briefly lay it over.

peelout wrote:

where or when did Roczen blame a lapper for making him fall this week?

did i miss it?

also, is your agenda the same if it were Roczen coming from behind and Tomac falling with a big lead?

i know, big IF, but some of you guys act like Roczen is under performing.

and yes, he did pull away from the same two guys that last week everyone was saying he was way off their pace

Sadly that seems to be a pattern on here,opinions can change from Moto to Moto,race to race,SX to Outdoors or season to season.

I don't think Roczen in under performing either,yes I thought he have had a win by now but all these guys are running some 450 times,that's Dungey and Stewart,not the rest,all the others in the 450 class would be outclassed by the front 250 riders.I think a lot of people forget that by all accounts it should be that much mor difficult for Roczen to win when he goes over there just like it would be for one of the Americans to come and do the GPs,but he's right up there,maybe a little unlucky to not have got a win yet,maybe his inexperience of racing in the new series

The board would've had a massively different look to it if he had held on to win his 1st ever race at Hangtown


(I also regret my username,funny at the time "you had to be there..")

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6/11/2012 3:48 PM
Edited Date/Time: 6/11/2012 3:53 PM

moto282 wrote:

-I didn't say Roczen blamed the lappers. People in this thread are saying it was the lappers fault (i.e. saying it was Kyle Peters).

-Yep, when Roczen wins... and he will, I would/will say the same.

-I think Roczen is doing fine and will only get better from here. I've said it in other threads. I think he just has to get his confidence back. All speculation-but I think SX got in his head a little bit. Once he wins a moto, I predict he starts winning more motos.

-What I don't agree with is taking anything away from the other 3 guys. i.e. Tomac starts in the back of the pack and catches the leaders and yet Roczen "schooled" them. That "schooling" post is what I responded to.

I agree with you and Geoff on the SX part.

How can SX not have effected his confidence? He got beat; convincingly & repeatedly.

Bar his early rookie races (at 14/15 years old), 2012 SX was the first time that any competitor has truly had his number. That's got to take some getting used to, and wonder if he brought some of that baggage to the Nationals.

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6/11/2012 6:53 PM

I just watched the race. I don't understand why all the focus is on Roczen. Looks like Barcia and especially Baggett succumbed to the intensity as well in that second moto. The common factor is that Tomac was just on fire.

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6/12/2012 12:50 AM

burnside wrote:

I agree with you and Geoff on the SX part.

How can SX not have effected his confidence? He got beat; convincingly & repeatedly.

Bar his early rookie races (at 14/15 years old), 2012 SX was the first time that any competitor has truly had his number. That's got to take some getting used to, and wonder if he brought some of that baggage to the Nationals.

I also go along With the SX in many ways,when he first did SX before the GPs started last year it was an extremely steep learning curve for him,he had everything needed to win but was very raw and needed to refine things,he won in the end which was pretty impressive considering but was crashing a lot and lucky to get out uninjured

Apart from a round or 2 I don't know if he honestly expected to win coming into this year on the East coast or then the West after the broken arm,Barcia,but I really think the injury rocked him,it messed up plans,gave him a lot of free time and put him back,at 17 it was his first surgery and first major setback of his career,also along with it came the arm pump problems,I think its a number of factors why he's maybe a click away from where he could/should be,the way of racing the outdoors adding to things

I don't think its just all about getting beat for the first time,he didn't have it all his own way at many times in the GPs,Herlings gave him a big ass kicking a few times and got onto his level,Kenny wasn't so invincible afterall


(I also regret my username,funny at the time "you had to be there..")

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6/12/2012 1:48 AM

Derpin' DJ wrote:

I just watched the race. I don't understand why all the focus is on Roczen. Looks like Barcia and especially Baggett succumbed to the intensity as well in that second moto. The common factor is that Tomac was just on fire.

Roczen =

Barcia & especially Tomac have really stepped it up this year and good for them! Its just a shame Wilson is missing out on the action.

Jeff Emigs Keys to the Race:
1. Get a good start
2. Don't crash

Jamie_Munro

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6/12/2012 3:19 AM

Derpin' DJ wrote:

I just watched the race. I don't understand why all the focus is on Roczen. Looks like Barcia and especially Baggett succumbed to the intensity as well in that second moto. The common factor is that Tomac was just on fire.

jamma10 wrote:

Roczen =

Barcia & especially Tomac have really stepped it up this year and good for them! Its just a shame Wilson is missing out on the action.

hard to disagree with you both - that's about fair. Tomac was the beast this weekend, but that is what we expect - he really deserved the win.

Huckster

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6/12/2012 3:21 AM

Derpin' DJ wrote:

I just watched the race. I don't understand why all the focus is on Roczen. Looks like Barcia and especially Baggett succumbed to the intensity as well in that second moto. The common factor is that Tomac was just on fire.

jamma10 wrote:

Roczen =

Barcia & especially Tomac have really stepped it up this year and good for them! Its just a shame Wilson is missing out on the action.

He is a 2x WORLD CHAMP and was touted by some as the "fastest lites rider in the WORLD" With that billing and hype most expected him to dominate outdoors which was also touted as his 'specialty". Of course he is doing awesome and is right in the title hunt and mix of things with the 3 oher guys, but the problem lies in the fact that unless he went 24-0 there was no way he was going to live up to the hype of those who felt it necssary to pump him up in order to defend the honor of the GP riders. Dominating a one off race with 2 other fast "lites" guys in it is one thing, winning an ama national moto/overall/championship is a whole other deal.....

mxgeoff

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6/12/2012 3:41 AM

Derpin' DJ wrote:

I just watched the race. I don't understand why all the focus is on Roczen. Looks like Barcia and especially Baggett succumbed to the intensity as well in that second moto. The common factor is that Tomac was just on fire.

jamma10 wrote:

Roczen =

Barcia & especially Tomac have really stepped it up this year and good for them! Its just a shame Wilson is missing out on the action.

Huckster wrote:

He is a 2x WORLD CHAMP and was touted by some as the "fastest lites rider in the WORLD" With that billing and hype most expected him to dominate outdoors which was also touted as his 'specialty". Of course he is doing awesome and is right in the title hunt and mix of things with the 3 oher guys, but the problem lies in the fact that unless he went 24-0 there was no way he was going to live up to the hype of those who felt it necssary to pump him up in order to defend the honor of the GP riders. Dominating a one off race with 2 other fast "lites" guys in it is one thing, winning an ama national moto/overall/championship is a whole other deal.....

Sure, Roczen only beat Herlings and Searle in the MX2 title race. We saw how these guys did at the MXoN in 2011 and from what I saw they are as good as just about anything you got in the AMA series. The AMA 250cc series has awesome riders, but winning an FIM World MX2 Championship is also not easy for anyone, be it Roczen, Herlings, Barcia, Tomac, Searle or anyone else.

Lets give both series they respect.

jamma10

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6/12/2012 4:22 AM
Edited Date/Time: 6/12/2012 4:29 AM

Huckster wrote:

He is a 2x WORLD CHAMP and was touted by some as the "fastest lites rider in the WORLD" With that billing and hype most expected him to dominate outdoors which was also touted as his 'specialty". Of course he is doing awesome and is right in the title hunt and mix of things with the 3 oher guys, but the problem lies in the fact that unless he went 24-0 there was no way he was going to live up to the hype of those who felt it necssary to pump him up in order to defend the honor of the GP riders. Dominating a one off race with 2 other fast "lites" guys in it is one thing, winning an ama national moto/overall/championship is a whole other deal.....

Roczen only has one World title, which Im sure you know.

But yeah I agree with you 100%, thats why I posted that picture. I think everyone expected Baggett to be very strong but considering how they fared last year Im almost certain that Tomac and Barcia's great form so far has come as a surprise to most people. Last year, with all things considered, I think you could argue Roczen was the No.1 lites rider in the world, but this year, in America, he has some very strong competition (who have undoubtably improved since last year) and whoever wins the title this season probably will earn that mantle.

Considering his position as kind of the odd on out in that 'fab four' I think he's holding his own pretty well has been extremely consistent so far. If he can keep it up it will put him in very good stead come the end of the season, but in order to stay in touch he really needs to start finishing off these races that he keeps throwing away in the latter stages!

Jeff Emigs Keys to the Race:
1. Get a good start
2. Don't crash

Huckster

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6/12/2012 5:07 AM

jamma10 wrote:

Roczen only has one World title, which Im sure you know.

But yeah I agree with you 100%, thats why I posted that picture. I think everyone expected Baggett to be very strong but considering how they fared last year Im almost certain that Tomac and Barcia's great form so far has come as a surprise to most people. Last year, with all things considered, I think you could argue Roczen was the No.1 lites rider in the world, but this year, in America, he has some very strong competition (who have undoubtably improved since last year) and whoever wins the title this season probably will earn that mantle.

Considering his position as kind of the odd on out in that 'fab four' I think he's holding his own pretty well has been extremely consistent so far. If he can keep it up it will put him in very good stead come the end of the season, but in order to stay in touch he really needs to start finishing off these races that he keeps throwing away in the latter stages!

my bad on the 2x. I guess I was thinking of Musquin.

PressPassP

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6/12/2012 6:28 AM

Huckster wrote:

He is a 2x WORLD CHAMP and was touted by some as the "fastest lites rider in the WORLD" With that billing and hype most expected him to dominate outdoors which was also touted as his 'specialty". Of course he is doing awesome and is right in the title hunt and mix of things with the 3 oher guys, but the problem lies in the fact that unless he went 24-0 there was no way he was going to live up to the hype of those who felt it necssary to pump him up in order to defend the honor of the GP riders. Dominating a one off race with 2 other fast "lites" guys in it is one thing, winning an ama national moto/overall/championship is a whole other deal.....

I think its the fact that after pretty much dominating the event,250 wise 2 years in a row was why he was touted so highly and by people on both sides of the pond,this was the only time we got to see these guys go up against each other afterall

"Dominating a one off race with 2 other fast "lites" guys in it is one thing, winning an ama national moto/overall/championship is a whole other deal....."

I can agree to an extent,many people feel this way about the MXdN,yes it's flawed in the sense that it's never going to be a true reflection of how GP boys will do in AMA series and how the AMA riders would peform in a GP season

Having said that,you can only comment on the race itself at the time,some shine like Roczen and obviously Villopoto's awesome ride at Budds Creek,they can only race who's on the start line,but they are not racing all the AMA/GP riders all at the same time


(I also regret my username,funny at the time "you had to be there..")