Another Big Amateur Event .

MXR
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scott_nz
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1/9/2017 11:49am
does the US need another big Amateur event?
TXDirt
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1/9/2017 11:49am
Big amateur race a few days after Christmas? This after having spent thanksgiving down at the Mini O's? Not sure how many Mom's are going to go for this!
daemon616
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1/9/2017 11:59am
The amateurs are the only thing keeping this sport alive.
Mr. Info
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1/9/2017 12:09pm
Kids won't miss school cause schools on break, those that still go to school. It's being held during a slow time in SoCal and the weather if nice brings in the east coasters for some better weather. What might hurt is AMA membership required. I think his draw would be larger without it. But Ryan has been through all the amateur programs so he should know how to run the event if he has the right people. There are a lot of so called promoters that only want to be the star and the event 2nd and they know who they are so I don't need to name them. But I have met them all.

The Shop

smv ryder
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1/9/2017 12:10pm
TXDirt wrote:
Big amateur race a few days after Christmas? This after having spent thanksgiving down at the Mini O's? Not sure how many Mom's are going to...
Big amateur race a few days after Christmas? This after having spent thanksgiving down at the Mini O's? Not sure how many Mom's are going to go for this!
When you have already refinanced your home twice to get to mini o's why not again for this? I don't see that being an issue one bit when you have fininaced your life to have your kiddo be pro. It will be a huge event, especially when RV2 name on the race banner
rrjr
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1/9/2017 12:23pm
$10 per day gate fee, $10 per day pit parking pass, $50 per day RV parking, $10 per day pit vehicle pass.

So for a family of 4 to attend the race driving a truck pulling a toyhauler with a golf cart will cost them $550 to drive through the gate. That doesn't include any race entry fees, transponder fees or any other fees.

How they think it's ok to charge a gate fee and charge you for a spot to pit from is crazy. Where do they expect racers to park other than the pits? I guess you could get a room at the casino and pit out of their parking lot. It's only about a mile away.
MotoX85
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1/9/2017 1:19pm
They are trying to take the crowd that goes down south to practice during Christmas break and force the aspiring amateurs to hit another race.

Florida winter ams and Texas ams usually have races that weekend. looks like they are trying to stick their fingers in the pot.

Sorry we like to practice, dad and son vacation. No races for us.
MotoX85
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1/9/2017 1:21pm
rrjr wrote:
$10 per day gate fee, $10 per day pit parking pass, $50 per day RV parking, $10 per day pit vehicle pass. So for a family...
$10 per day gate fee, $10 per day pit parking pass, $50 per day RV parking, $10 per day pit vehicle pass.

So for a family of 4 to attend the race driving a truck pulling a toyhauler with a golf cart will cost them $550 to drive through the gate. That doesn't include any race entry fees, transponder fees or any other fees.

How they think it's ok to charge a gate fee and charge you for a spot to pit from is crazy. Where do they expect racers to park other than the pits? I guess you could get a room at the casino and pit out of their parking lot. It's only about a mile away.
And you put RVs name on it and your have 1000 riders show up and unload 6 PWs out of a Renegade with a stacker trailer dying to give them that money so they can go home and say little johnny was at the race
brocster
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1/9/2017 3:23pm
rrjr wrote:
$10 per day gate fee, $10 per day pit parking pass, $50 per day RV parking, $10 per day pit vehicle pass. So for a family...
$10 per day gate fee, $10 per day pit parking pass, $50 per day RV parking, $10 per day pit vehicle pass.

So for a family of 4 to attend the race driving a truck pulling a toyhauler with a golf cart will cost them $550 to drive through the gate. That doesn't include any race entry fees, transponder fees or any other fees.

How they think it's ok to charge a gate fee and charge you for a spot to pit from is crazy. Where do they expect racers to park other than the pits? I guess you could get a room at the casino and pit out of their parking lot. It's only about a mile away.
MotoX85 wrote:
And you put RVs name on it and your have 1000 riders show up and unload 6 PWs out of a Renegade with a stacker trailer...
And you put RVs name on it and your have 1000 riders show up and unload 6 PWs out of a Renegade with a stacker trailer dying to give them that money so they can go home and say little johnny was at the race
Better yet. Go home and say "Little Johnny got a trophy at the National's" albeit, last....
TW85
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1/9/2017 3:31pm Edited Date/Time 1/9/2017 3:32pm
As a vet rider who started as a vet rider this may not mean a whole lot but

When does this whole amateur thing slow down? I could care less about the parents spending big money to hit all these events. They're adults so it's their choice.

But how much are these kids sacrificing and yet don't see the negative until years down the road when they have no choice? Sure I would love to turn back time and be able to ride and compete as a kid and at a local level I'm sure it's a great healthy thing to do. What scares me is giving up other opportunities that the other kids those ages get to see and experience. I don't know just seems like way too much focus on one silly little sport (I love mx but big picture) for what reward? Be 1 out of 1000's of kids trying to be the next superstar is a bad bet.

tcallahan707
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Morrison, CO US
1/9/2017 4:24pm
rrjr wrote:
$10 per day gate fee, $10 per day pit parking pass, $50 per day RV parking, $10 per day pit vehicle pass. So for a family...
$10 per day gate fee, $10 per day pit parking pass, $50 per day RV parking, $10 per day pit vehicle pass.

So for a family of 4 to attend the race driving a truck pulling a toyhauler with a golf cart will cost them $550 to drive through the gate. That doesn't include any race entry fees, transponder fees or any other fees.

How they think it's ok to charge a gate fee and charge you for a spot to pit from is crazy. Where do they expect racers to park other than the pits? I guess you could get a room at the casino and pit out of their parking lot. It's only about a mile away.
MotoX85 wrote:
And you put RVs name on it and your have 1000 riders show up and unload 6 PWs out of a Renegade with a stacker trailer...
And you put RVs name on it and your have 1000 riders show up and unload 6 PWs out of a Renegade with a stacker trailer dying to give them that money so they can go home and say little johnny was at the race
brocster wrote:
Better yet. Go home and say "Little Johnny got a trophy at the National's" albeit, last....
I lose my mind when I see a kid on an 85 with 115 "National Titles" on his resume. Most of these amateur nationals are just regional events with the exception of one or two factory supported dudes showing up on the other side of the country. West Coast dudes do Mammoth, this RV thing, and World Minis. Midwest and Southeast run the Texas ones, and the East Coast do Mini O's and Daytona. Loretta's is the only National Title in my opinion. Good for the promoters though. The lure of an "amateur national" instantly means you get to charge double for everything.
yak651
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1/9/2017 4:27pm
TW85 wrote:
As a vet rider who started as a vet rider this may not mean a whole lot but When does this whole amateur thing slow down...
As a vet rider who started as a vet rider this may not mean a whole lot but

When does this whole amateur thing slow down? I could care less about the parents spending big money to hit all these events. They're adults so it's their choice.

But how much are these kids sacrificing and yet don't see the negative until years down the road when they have no choice? Sure I would love to turn back time and be able to ride and compete as a kid and at a local level I'm sure it's a great healthy thing to do. What scares me is giving up other opportunities that the other kids those ages get to see and experience. I don't know just seems like way too much focus on one silly little sport (I love mx but big picture) for what reward? Be 1 out of 1000's of kids trying to be the next superstar is a bad bet.

It's not just this sport it's all sports. If your kid doesn't play summer league soccer they will not sniff the starting line up. If your kid doesn't participate in the summer weight program he's not going to be on the varsity football team. Had friends tell me they can't go on summer vacation because their kid will not get to start if they miss any of the work outs. It's crazy how much the parents will put up with because they weren't a star in school but want their kids to be...oh and the .01% chance of being a pro athlete
vetmxr
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1/9/2017 4:38pm Edited Date/Time 1/9/2017 4:38pm
I'd take one look at the prices.....then immediately turn around and go find an open prepped ride day somewhere , spend 100 bucks to get the family in.....and ride our asses off all day on our own scheduale.

That is unless i happened to be one of the chosen ones that spawned a super fast, fearless, arrogant, entitled, child that absolutely needs every advantage given to them because they are on the fast track to the top...and no expense can be spared.
TXDirt
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1/9/2017 4:39pm
TXDirt wrote:
Big amateur race a few days after Christmas? This after having spent thanksgiving down at the Mini O's? Not sure how many Mom's are going to...
Big amateur race a few days after Christmas? This after having spent thanksgiving down at the Mini O's? Not sure how many Mom's are going to go for this!
smv ryder wrote:
When you have already refinanced your home twice to get to mini o's why not again for this? I don't see that being an issue one...
When you have already refinanced your home twice to get to mini o's why not again for this? I don't see that being an issue one bit when you have fininaced your life to have your kiddo be pro. It will be a huge event, especially when RV2 name on the race banner
I hear you and agree to a point. But there are still some things that don't take a backseat to a race. I believe Christmas is still one of those things. There are already many amateur races sprinkled throughout the year. There may be a decent draw from west coast riders but I highly doubt they draw much from the middle of the country and the east coast. A top rider who already wants to race and train a little in Cali? Maybe. But no way will you draw the meat and potatoes of a division like you do for some of the other races. Just not going to happen.

TW85
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1/9/2017 5:13pm
TW85 wrote:
As a vet rider who started as a vet rider this may not mean a whole lot but When does this whole amateur thing slow down...
As a vet rider who started as a vet rider this may not mean a whole lot but

When does this whole amateur thing slow down? I could care less about the parents spending big money to hit all these events. They're adults so it's their choice.

But how much are these kids sacrificing and yet don't see the negative until years down the road when they have no choice? Sure I would love to turn back time and be able to ride and compete as a kid and at a local level I'm sure it's a great healthy thing to do. What scares me is giving up other opportunities that the other kids those ages get to see and experience. I don't know just seems like way too much focus on one silly little sport (I love mx but big picture) for what reward? Be 1 out of 1000's of kids trying to be the next superstar is a bad bet.

yak651 wrote:
It's not just this sport it's all sports. If your kid doesn't play summer league soccer they will not sniff the starting line up. If your...
It's not just this sport it's all sports. If your kid doesn't play summer league soccer they will not sniff the starting line up. If your kid doesn't participate in the summer weight program he's not going to be on the varsity football team. Had friends tell me they can't go on summer vacation because their kid will not get to start if they miss any of the work outs. It's crazy how much the parents will put up with because they weren't a star in school but want their kids to be...oh and the .01% chance of being a pro athlete
You're right and I agree to a point. If my brain is working right soccer clubs do lock kids up at a crazy to me early age.

Anyways from my area I've known a handful of guys who have made it to pro hockey. All of them lived at hbme and went to school in their local area up until at least 16 and then usually played at the top amateur level and transferred to whatever school was close to the team they played for. They still all had a life outside of hockey yet your right did give up A LOT of free time. For what it's worth the ones doing best in life fizzled out early and were able to move on. Those in the middle area like a privateer are sort of in a bad spot if you were forecasting the next 5 years.

Moto, I guess the thing that gets me is the age, risk, home schooling at such a young age and the training centres. 2 week long camps or workshops are cool. Show young kids you work hard you will see results...6 month spans at a training centre not so healthy. There is to much value placed on these national events that kids at 10-12 years old are literally risking their life trying to win because of pressure of all that's invested.

Corporate sponsorship is a little sick at ages of 8-14 if you ask me. What happens to little man after he thinks he owns the world and then his 18 birthday comes around and no ones there because the results weren't.

Again I don`t disagree with your point about all sports but I love moto and it burns my balls a little how the kids are treated. I know they love it at the time but 10 years later happens for everyone not just the few that make it.
Ehm24
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1/9/2017 5:36pm
yak651 wrote:
It's not just this sport it's all sports. If your kid doesn't play summer league soccer they will not sniff the starting line up. If your...
It's not just this sport it's all sports. If your kid doesn't play summer league soccer they will not sniff the starting line up. If your kid doesn't participate in the summer weight program he's not going to be on the varsity football team. Had friends tell me they can't go on summer vacation because their kid will not get to start if they miss any of the work outs. It's crazy how much the parents will put up with because they weren't a star in school but want their kids to be...oh and the .01% chance of being a pro athlete
I never really went on summer vacations because of this (for football) but it was never due to my parents pushing me. I just felt very dedicated to the sport! Sometimes it's not about the crazy parents, it's the crazy kids!!
LungButter
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1/9/2017 5:42pm
rrjr wrote:
$10 per day gate fee, $10 per day pit parking pass, $50 per day RV parking, $10 per day pit vehicle pass. So for a family...
$10 per day gate fee, $10 per day pit parking pass, $50 per day RV parking, $10 per day pit vehicle pass.

So for a family of 4 to attend the race driving a truck pulling a toyhauler with a golf cart will cost them $550 to drive through the gate. That doesn't include any race entry fees, transponder fees or any other fees.

How they think it's ok to charge a gate fee and charge you for a spot to pit from is crazy. Where do they expect racers to park other than the pits? I guess you could get a room at the casino and pit out of their parking lot. It's only about a mile away.
I find a little irony in someone who is driving a truck, pulling a toy hauler full of dirt bikes and a golf cart complaining about an extra $10 to park it, but that's just me.
moscrop940
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Temecula, CA US
1/9/2017 6:33pm
I would like to hear them explain to me the difference between a gate fee and a pit parking pass....and why I must pay both.

Been to 100 different tracks and never had someone say " that'll be X bucks to drive through the gate, and another X to park"

The sport is on the decline, and theres no denying it....add some more fees like this and its going to continue that downward spiral. No wonder people are buying razors and just hitting the desert as oppose to racing every weekend


rrjr
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1/9/2017 6:42pm
rrjr wrote:
$10 per day gate fee, $10 per day pit parking pass, $50 per day RV parking, $10 per day pit vehicle pass. So for a family...
$10 per day gate fee, $10 per day pit parking pass, $50 per day RV parking, $10 per day pit vehicle pass.

So for a family of 4 to attend the race driving a truck pulling a toyhauler with a golf cart will cost them $550 to drive through the gate. That doesn't include any race entry fees, transponder fees or any other fees.

How they think it's ok to charge a gate fee and charge you for a spot to pit from is crazy. Where do they expect racers to park other than the pits? I guess you could get a room at the casino and pit out of their parking lot. It's only about a mile away.
LungButter wrote:
I find a little irony in someone who is driving a truck, pulling a toy hauler full of dirt bikes and a golf cart complaining about...
I find a little irony in someone who is driving a truck, pulling a toy hauler full of dirt bikes and a golf cart complaining about an extra $10 to park it, but that's just me.
Well it's actually an extra $50 for the 5 days and you won't see me paying it. We live 20 min from Pala and no way I'd pay that much. You could race 7 or 8 TWMX races for the money it will cost you just to get in the gate. Then $100 per class race fees. No thanks.
bsharkey
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1/9/2017 9:33pm
MotoX85 wrote:
And you put RVs name on it and your have 1000 riders show up and unload 6 PWs out of a Renegade with a stacker trailer...
And you put RVs name on it and your have 1000 riders show up and unload 6 PWs out of a Renegade with a stacker trailer dying to give them that money so they can go home and say little johnny was at the race
brocster wrote:
Better yet. Go home and say "Little Johnny got a trophy at the National's" albeit, last....
I lose my mind when I see a kid on an 85 with 115 "National Titles" on his resume. Most of these amateur nationals are just...
I lose my mind when I see a kid on an 85 with 115 "National Titles" on his resume. Most of these amateur nationals are just regional events with the exception of one or two factory supported dudes showing up on the other side of the country. West Coast dudes do Mammoth, this RV thing, and World Minis. Midwest and Southeast run the Texas ones, and the East Coast do Mini O's and Daytona. Loretta's is the only National Title in my opinion. Good for the promoters though. The lure of an "amateur national" instantly means you get to charge double for everything.
Mammoth has pretty much turned into lorettas now. Most of the big names go to it
steveada
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Evans, GA US
1/10/2017 5:35am
I think a lot of you guys are missing out on something here. A race like mini-o's draws what, a few thousand riders? Sure you get all the top factory sponsored guys and all the wannabees in their big RV's and trailers full of bikes. But if only those people showed up the gates would be half full. The great majority of people who go are just normal people whose families enjoy racing and have made it a family vacation doing something together that they love. Sure, the racing is part of it, but it is more than just a race. Yes it is expensive, but so is a week at disneyland or a week in the Bahamas. I am sure it is the same at Mammoth and some of the other big races. What I don't like is the thinking that they can put RV's name on the race, charge prices on par with mini o's or LL's, and instantly become important and compete with the long tradition of races like mini o's or LL's. Maybe in 10 years they will have built something, but for now it is just another overpriced pseudo-national.
Dtat720
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Flowood, MS US
1/10/2017 5:41am
steveada wrote:
I think a lot of you guys are missing out on something here. A race like mini-o's draws what, a few thousand riders? Sure you get...
I think a lot of you guys are missing out on something here. A race like mini-o's draws what, a few thousand riders? Sure you get all the top factory sponsored guys and all the wannabees in their big RV's and trailers full of bikes. But if only those people showed up the gates would be half full. The great majority of people who go are just normal people whose families enjoy racing and have made it a family vacation doing something together that they love. Sure, the racing is part of it, but it is more than just a race. Yes it is expensive, but so is a week at disneyland or a week in the Bahamas. I am sure it is the same at Mammoth and some of the other big races. What I don't like is the thinking that they can put RV's name on the race, charge prices on par with mini o's or LL's, and instantly become important and compete with the long tradition of races like mini o's or LL's. Maybe in 10 years they will have built something, but for now it is just another overpriced pseudo-national.
Its basically what LL's did with Ponca City. In the 80's Ponca was the go to national, Mini O's later in the year and Lorettas was just a race. But it got better and better and look at it now. Lorettas is the go to and Ponca shit the bed
Paw Paw 271
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1/10/2017 6:39am Edited Date/Time 1/10/2017 6:41am
TW85 wrote:
As a vet rider who started as a vet rider this may not mean a whole lot but When does this whole amateur thing slow down...
As a vet rider who started as a vet rider this may not mean a whole lot but

When does this whole amateur thing slow down? I could care less about the parents spending big money to hit all these events. They're adults so it's their choice.

But how much are these kids sacrificing and yet don't see the negative until years down the road when they have no choice? Sure I would love to turn back time and be able to ride and compete as a kid and at a local level I'm sure it's a great healthy thing to do. What scares me is giving up other opportunities that the other kids those ages get to see and experience. I don't know just seems like way too much focus on one silly little sport (I love mx but big picture) for what reward? Be 1 out of 1000's of kids trying to be the next superstar is a bad bet.

Great words!!!!!!! I have seen too many fail and their parents go broke in the process.
X2

Paw Paw
MX114
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1/10/2017 8:32am Edited Date/Time 1/10/2017 10:02am
moscrop940 wrote:
I would like to hear them explain to me the difference between a gate fee and a pit parking pass....and why I must pay both. Been...
I would like to hear them explain to me the difference between a gate fee and a pit parking pass....and why I must pay both.

Been to 100 different tracks and never had someone say " that'll be X bucks to drive through the gate, and another X to park"

The sport is on the decline, and theres no denying it....add some more fees like this and its going to continue that downward spiral. No wonder people are buying razors and just hitting the desert as oppose to racing every weekend


Unadilla does that for Amateur day the last 5-6 years maybe. Charges a "gate fee" then a separate "camping fee" on top of that. Then there's the increased "sign up" fees since it's the weekend of the national. So by the time you break down the price for your 3 lap moto per lap, you mine as well just punch yourself in the nuts
MX114
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1/10/2017 8:33am Edited Date/Time 1/10/2017 8:37am
At least with lorettas you pay the one gate fee and everyone in your vehicle is included all week.
MotoX85
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Centralia, IL US
1/10/2017 8:42am
TW85 wrote:
As a vet rider who started as a vet rider this may not mean a whole lot but When does this whole amateur thing slow down...
As a vet rider who started as a vet rider this may not mean a whole lot but

When does this whole amateur thing slow down? I could care less about the parents spending big money to hit all these events. They're adults so it's their choice.

But how much are these kids sacrificing and yet don't see the negative until years down the road when they have no choice? Sure I would love to turn back time and be able to ride and compete as a kid and at a local level I'm sure it's a great healthy thing to do. What scares me is giving up other opportunities that the other kids those ages get to see and experience. I don't know just seems like way too much focus on one silly little sport (I love mx but big picture) for what reward? Be 1 out of 1000's of kids trying to be the next superstar is a bad bet.

18 for us, we are not aspiring amateurs by any means but when he starts college the racing will definitely be cut

With that being said, I will finance any riding he still wants to do at any level as long as it does not interfere with college, as any father would. He's pretty fast, but no where near making a living, fast. we still will probably make our annual father/son trips down south since this is now a tradition but to answer your question, he is wanting to go try for Lorettas this year and we will go full bore with all the races but next year those type races with taper off.

I started racing at a older age, road all my life, so I never really cared for the AM Nats either. But they can be fun if you have no concern for money and are not a Dad living your life through little Johnny and face the facts that without you yelling at him, if hes not running top 2 or 3 at nationals now, make sure he stays in college so when you face reality and blow up and selling everything, he till has a future
moscrop940
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Temecula, CA US
1/10/2017 9:51am
moscrop940 wrote:
I would like to hear them explain to me the difference between a gate fee and a pit parking pass....and why I must pay both. Been...
I would like to hear them explain to me the difference between a gate fee and a pit parking pass....and why I must pay both.

Been to 100 different tracks and never had someone say " that'll be X bucks to drive through the gate, and another X to park"

The sport is on the decline, and theres no denying it....add some more fees like this and its going to continue that downward spiral. No wonder people are buying razors and just hitting the desert as oppose to racing every weekend


MX114 wrote:
Unadilla does that for Amateur day the last 5-6 years maybe. Charges a "gate fee" then a separate "camping fee" on top of that. Then there's...
Unadilla does that for Amateur day the last 5-6 years maybe. Charges a "gate fee" then a separate "camping fee" on top of that. Then there's the increased "sign up" fees since it's the weekend of the national. So by the time you break down the price for your 3 lap moto per lap, you mine as well just punch yourself in the nuts
All I will say is I am happy I had a little girl and will probably not be chasing the moto dream with her....the cost of everything has gotten so far out of control, with no end in sight, I can't see how 99% of people would afford it 10 years from now
TBO
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Powell, OH US
1/10/2017 10:05am
TW85 wrote:
As a vet rider who started as a vet rider this may not mean a whole lot but When does this whole amateur thing slow down...
As a vet rider who started as a vet rider this may not mean a whole lot but

When does this whole amateur thing slow down? I could care less about the parents spending big money to hit all these events. They're adults so it's their choice.

But how much are these kids sacrificing and yet don't see the negative until years down the road when they have no choice? Sure I would love to turn back time and be able to ride and compete as a kid and at a local level I'm sure it's a great healthy thing to do. What scares me is giving up other opportunities that the other kids those ages get to see and experience. I don't know just seems like way too much focus on one silly little sport (I love mx but big picture) for what reward? Be 1 out of 1000's of kids trying to be the next superstar is a bad bet.

MotoX85 wrote:
18 for us, we are not aspiring amateurs by any means but when he starts college the racing will definitely be cut With that being said...
18 for us, we are not aspiring amateurs by any means but when he starts college the racing will definitely be cut

With that being said, I will finance any riding he still wants to do at any level as long as it does not interfere with college, as any father would. He's pretty fast, but no where near making a living, fast. we still will probably make our annual father/son trips down south since this is now a tradition but to answer your question, he is wanting to go try for Lorettas this year and we will go full bore with all the races but next year those type races with taper off.

I started racing at a older age, road all my life, so I never really cared for the AM Nats either. But they can be fun if you have no concern for money and are not a Dad living your life through little Johnny and face the facts that without you yelling at him, if hes not running top 2 or 3 at nationals now, make sure he stays in college so when you face reality and blow up and selling everything, he till has a future
With all the crazy stuff I read on Vital, this may be the most rational thing I've ever read!

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