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I STILL think EA Supercross 2000 (N64/PSX) is the best MX/SX game.

starchildeyes

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6/13/2012 10:39 AM
Edited Date/Time: 6/13/2012 12:20 PM

Sure, Reflex and Alive have good arcade/sim physics and yes MXS is brilliant but doesn't include real riders and a replica points series which I prefer and yes, MUD is fun and MTX was great (though too fast for my taste) but in the end there is STILL one Supercross game that stands above them all to me. And yes, it is ridiculous that the game is 13 years old now.

EA Sports Supercross 2000 for the Nintendo 64 (and also for the PS1) had it all and really was so far ahead of it's time. It's not perfect and it is two generations behind in systems but compared to the other SX/MX games it is still my favorite.

The reviews weren't that great because the game's controls were a bit touchy (like most simulations or somewhat simulation like games) but with practice the control is very good. And no, the clutch doesn't reallly do much but for it's time the physics were pretty realistic.

EA's Supercross 2000 had so much great in it such as:

Pretty realistic physics engine. Not MXS realistic but still very difficult to master and I would say it was very simulation based, especially for it's time. Moreso than nearly every other SX game. Bikes look great as the go through the whoops and overall the physics engine is very good.

Realistic speed and pacing of bikes.

You must brake and let off throttle alot. Throttle control is huge.

Rhythm section timing is crucial.

You don't jump over everything. Some sections you single or double or triple over but some you roll over. Just like in real SX. You don't just pin it like you do in most SX games like all the old MVA games and the jumps don't propel you hundreds of yards, unrealistically. Yes, turning in this game is a pain and too slow but they were trying to make the game more realistic and it works. It looks and feels like a race of that era other than the sometimes sluggish turning.

2 heats, lcqs and full 20 lap mains!! that's a biggee!

10 riders at the gate. Not bad!

Full accurate AMA SX points series! That's huge!

Full race replays.

AI on Pro is very challenging. I win but not consistently and you can make it harder with skill attribute changes.

Real riders from the 98-99 season. No RC or MC due to them having their all games but greats such as Emig, Ferry, Windham, Ward, Albertyn, Tortelli, Larocco, Huffman, Pichon and lots more.

Since EA was the actual sponsor of SX, the tracks are decent replicas and have all the official names and layouts and really feel like the real deals not the fantasy MVA SX tracks and MUD FIM tracks. The Daytona track is real cool and just like the real Daytona very different from all the other SX tracks.

Bikes aren't floaty. Speeds aren't exagerrated.

This is one of my favorite aspects of the game. BY FAR! ESPN2 like tv style presentation with the greatest SX commentator of all time, Art Eckman, doing the pbp and David Bailey on color Sure it gets a bit monotonous but the commentary is very accurate and no one else has done it in a SX/MX game even 13 years later and two generations of systems later. Plus having those 2 great voices make it sound and feel like Supercross. Great realistic tv style atmosphere. They tell who gets the holeshot, who's ahead, who's behind, who crashes and also give some nice tidbits about riders and tracks and the history of SX. The PSX commentary is a bit more varied and detailed as it has Bailey as well as Eckman. Hearing Eckman call the names KDub and Fro just make this game the best to me and you will also hear his signature lines such as "he showed him a wheel" and "they're rubbing plastic" and "they're going bar to bar!!". AWESOME STUFF!

Pre-race rider lineups and heat/lcq and main post-race standings. Nice season points standings menus.

Multiple camera views. I like the Path view alot. it is sort of up high. Very cool.

Full AMA and Pace Supercross license.

Graphics are crappy of course (it was 1999 after all) but animations are pretty good and if you get the N64 Expansion pal the N64 version looks MUCH MUCH better than the PSX version. No Bailey on color for the N64 version, though.

No unrealistic pre-load or scrub buttons. You control it all with brake/gas/control/control of bike.

Nice force feedback effect on the controller especially on the N64 version with the rumble pak. You feel the whoops!

Proper rider and bike/track scaling.

Having a competitive AI (that doesn't cheat) makes going to the lcq pretty nerve wracking especially if you are near the end of a season and need those valuable points.

If a current game had this engine and game layout with updated riders/teams/graphics it would absolutely SMOKE every other SX/MX game. I still think this is the best SX/MX game there is. And yes it is dated and looks bad and the bike sounds suck but it has EVERYTHING else and feels right. Of course it would be cool to have teh updated Alive/Reflex control and such but again, this game feels right. And the tracks feel right and feel realistic.

I'm sure there are some who think I'm delirious in declaring this the best Supercross/Motocross game ever but I've played them all (and appreciate them all for various reasons) but this one replicates the whole atmosphere of Supercross the best to me. And I know lots of people loved Reflex. I actually thought Alive was better as the track scales were more realistic and the bikes had weight but no SX and completely unrealistic Nationals (other than the JS7 stuff) made Alive pretty worthless. Reflex had potential but floaty weightless bikes, kamikaze AI riders, poor Nationals and no points series in either pretty much ruin what could have been very good games.

I would love to hear some thoughts/good times/ect from you guys who used to play or maybe still play EA's Supercross 2000 which, to me, was an underated gem of a game. It was a shame that for the sequel (just called Supercross, released in 2001 as if the excellent Supercross 2000 game never existed) they went completely away fromt he simulatoin style and went total arcade. Meh.

Motodave15

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6/14/2012 6:29 PM

This is a very long post... But man i played ea sx2000 sooo much when i was a kid it wasn't even funny. I remeber seattle always being the hardest track for me, idk if it was because of how simple it was or what.. but i always had a hell of a time trying to qualify there vs the AI.

I miss that game, track deteroration commentarty, qualfying. man it was all there.

If somebody would replicate that game, just modern... mother of god they would sell like hot cakes in the winter.

But most company's seem to be stuck with the whole casual gamer bs. that forces us to have shitty console mx games like mx vs atv alive.

So until whoever pull's there heads out of their assess first. I will be playing mx simulator.

It's funny the old school mx games, never really catered to the casual gimmick gamers like they do now.

Thats one reason why i respect mx simulator so much.. its for the hardcore and its rewarding.

"First in command of the Not a quad brigade" 1-table-1 is not a quad!! Stamp it!!

starchildeyes

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6/14/2012 11:15 PM

Cool thoughts, dude! Thanks for sharing.

Yeah, I am on Pro and barely made it out the lcq and finished 9th with Emig in Round 4.

Another thing I like that if you crash or go down it is very difficult to get back up front. You really have to choose lines and put in some good lap times to move back up. The AI is tremendous!

I dig MXS but I'm in an area STILL without high speed so I have to play against the AI and the AI pretty much worthless in MXS as it is either super easy like the default tracks or not even trained as with most downloaded tracks. Plus as brilliant as it is it just doesn't capture the feel of watching the old Speedworld broadcasts like Supercross 2000 does.

DoctorJD

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6/15/2012 5:30 AM

They got a lot of things right about that game, but they got an equal number of things totally wrong. The gameplay and physics were horrid, as was the audio (even for that era). I found this clip on youtube. Everything looks great til about 3:30, when the actual gameplay begins.

"I mean honestly, up-and-coming riders? I'd just advise them to quit, cuz' they'll never be as good as me." Ronnie Mac

starchildeyes

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6/15/2012 8:13 AM

Yeah, the bike sounds are atrocious as I had mentioned before but overall I think it captures supercross as a whole best. And the N64 version (with the high resolution graphics expansion pak) looks probably twice as good as the PSX version shown here. Graphics aren't that important to me but it is nice that the N64 version looks better and WAY less pixelized which is just really hard to look at in these HD days.

DoctorJD, I totally disagree that the gameplay and physics were horrid. You actually have to slow down for corners and time everything decently to get good lap times. I'm not sure what your MX game preference is but hey, to each his own. I just know that I really have to pay attention and concentrate while playing this game (much like MXS which I admire but don't play that much) just to keep the bike straight and to not bog down in corners and botch my jumps and timing sections. I know in the old MVA games you could just pin it and rail around what seemed like the most exaggerated berm and track sizes ever. In Reflex and Alive you did have to brake but Reflex was hampered by floaty bouncy physics and Alive could have been great if there had actually been some decent tracks other than the JS7 stuff.

But even with all that said, none of the MVA games let you go thru a full points series with heats, lcqs, full 20 lap mains, etc. That, to me, is pivotal.

But hey, I love MX gaming discussion so would love to hear yours and others thoughts on this game as well as your favorites and why.

rc4187

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6/15/2012 9:32 AM

I put this in the n64 last night and played about 10 mins bc of your post. The game is terrible. Yes, the game modes are well done, but the game play is awful. If slowing down in corners means do a complete stop... then yes, you do that a lot. Also the suspension is so bouncy / mushy that you just plow through the jumps. I remember when it first came out and I thought it was terrible then as well, but for some reason I played it anyway. The commentary gets old very fast. I had to mute most sounds as they were making my ears bleed. Most feature rich moto games were motocross madness 2 and the first mx unleashed (imo).

Motocross83

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6/15/2012 10:25 AM
Edited Date/Time: 6/15/2012 10:30 AM

I also still have Supercross 2000 and Supercross 2001 (as well as MX featuring RC 2001) for the PS1 and though 2000 has some good points, overall I much prefer 2001. Imo it has a far better flow and sense of pace than 2000, and yet still retains most of the good things already mentioned - strong AI, Championship chase etc. Each to their own though.

I'm glad you started this thread though because they're (some of the earliest MX titles) still solid games in their own right and I hadn't thought about digging them out and enjoying them again in ages until I read through your review.

Just a shame that all these years later in a time of mainstream gaming and vast leaps in technology - we still can't quite get the definitive virtual MX experience.

starchildeyes

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6/15/2012 12:18 PM

Man, back in the early 2000's we had so many Supercross/Motocross games. EA's 2001 and 2001, Supercross Circuit, RC's Championship Motocross and the McGrath games. Nowadays we can't get any SX games at all.

I see there is some difference of opinions here which is all good. Anyway else love any of the older games? I thought Supercross Circuit could have been cool but it's just too fast and the camera way too close for my tastes.

starchildeyes

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6/15/2012 12:41 PM

I could enjoy EA's Supercross 2001 a bit but not nearly as much as 2000 for a few solid reasons.

No heats or lcqs

Championship points series won't let you have 20 lap mains. 5 is the max. I can't believe they didn't let you do full races in season mode.

Framerate is very poor.

The turiing is too effective in 2001. They went too far the other way by going with the arcade power turn method. EXTREMELY arcade.

starchildeyes

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6/15/2012 1:25 PM
Edited Date/Time: 6/15/2012 1:27 PM

And the lack of decent points series really hurts all the MX/SX games. Only a few games, EA Supercross 2000, RC's Championship 2001, Supercross Circuit and MUD FIM Motocross, have full points series. Reflex had a points series with heats and lcqs but there was only 8 rounds (which only 7 were actually Supercross) and the Mains were a pitiful 3 laps and couldn't be changed. 3 laps???? C'mon!

starchildeyes

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6/15/2012 2:04 PM

I took the day off work today before me and Wife head to Budd's Creek tomorrow so after I did the honey-do list I have been playing MX/SX games all afternoon.

I still say that despite it's flaws that Supercross 2000 for N64 is the best overall SX/MX game. I am on Pro and me (as Emig) and KDub just pretty much went back and for for over 17 laps battling for 4th position. I don't recall that happening very often in any other game.

Good times....on such an old game!!
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